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Virtual PC and VMware #1040581
11/11/15 02:45 PM
11/11/15 02:45 PM
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petert Offline OP
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Is there a recommended site from which I could download Virtual PC to run on Windows 7?

There appear to be several sources available but I am wary of going to a site that could be unsafe.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1040586
11/11/15 03:34 PM
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The best place to go is the source -

Virtual PC 2007

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1040764
11/12/15 04:52 PM
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Thanks for the tip.
I have looked at the Microsoft site, but I can't see a reference to whether it is correct for Windows 7 - it refers to Vista and XP.

Should I just go ahead and download the 64bit version and go from there? Perhaps it will explain there?

I would like to put W98 and XP on Virtual PC if that is possible.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1040776
11/12/15 06:14 PM
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It will run just fine on Windows 7 although you may have to rename the file once it's downloaded. As I recall they looked specifically for the executable and blocked it (although that could have been Windows 8). A better solution (in my opinion) is to install VMware Player and run XP under it. It supports Accelerated Graphics for XP and above.

You can find it here: VMWare Player Free

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: InlandAZ] #1040784
11/12/15 07:32 PM
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I have Virtual PC on my Windows 7 machine and it works great. I don't think we needed to rename the file.

Inland's suggestion about VMWare Player is a good one.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041105
11/14/15 05:33 PM
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I downloaded VMware Player, but it will not let me load W98. It says that 'this version of the file is not compatible with the version of the Windows which you are running', and asks me to consult my computer system information as to whether I need the 32bit version or the 64bit version and then contact the software publisher. I know that my present computer is the 64 bit version but what use is that to me, given that Microsoft certainly does not support W98.
I will therefore try to load XP into the VMware player into my Windows 7 computer and see if that will work.
But I am not holding my breath.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041109
11/14/15 06:01 PM
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Good job I wasn't holding my breath. I would have been dead by now.

A Fatal Error has occurred. Quelle surprise.

I am not sure that I can be bothered to go through all that again to try and figure out what has gone wrong.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041111
11/14/15 06:26 PM
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There is only 1 installer for VMware Player, it support both 32 and 64 bit operating systems. It runs just fine on all of my Windows 7 PC's. Are you sure you downloaded the Windows installer?

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041119
11/14/15 07:23 PM
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Wasn't there a Virtual PC 2007 SP1 version?
I think that's what I have on my Windows 7 x64 computer.
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/...034bcdd6d2=True

When you click the download button on the above webpage, you should get a choice of 32-bit or 64-bit.
Put a check in the box next to the one you want, click Next, and a setup should download.
The setup files for the 32-bit and 64-bit versions have different md5sums so can't be exactly the same.

Originally Posted By: Marian
I have Virtual PC on my Windows 7 machine and it works great. I don't think we needed to rename the file.

You don't have to rename the file for Windows 7.
There is no problem with installing Virtual PC on Windows 7.
But renaming the file is one of several things you have to do in order to get Virtual PC installed and working without crashing on Windows 8.

Originally Posted By: petert
I downloaded VMware Player, but it will not let me load W98. It says that 'this version of the file is not compatible with the version of the Windows which you are running', and asks me to consult my computer system information as to whether I need the 32bit version or the 64bit version and then contact the software publisher.

That sounds like VMware may have created an environment that's friendly to 64-bit guests but not 32-bit guests.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041143
11/14/15 09:08 PM
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I'm running a 32 bit Windows 98 under VMware - I'm not sure what it is that's generating the error message.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: InlandAZ] #1041190
11/15/15 09:18 AM
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Do you need a key to install win 98SE on Virtual PC?

Sharon

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: SharonB] #1041205
11/15/15 11:44 AM
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Originally Posted By: SharonB
Do you need a key to install win 98SE on Virtual PC?

Sharon



No, it is freeware.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041216
11/15/15 12:46 PM
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SharonB, were you asking if you need a 98SE key to install on VPC? I was curious too.


Once again, weeds are my life!
Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041228
11/15/15 01:16 PM
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Oh, hadn't thought of that one - but, it looks like she is. Yes, you will need install media and it's key.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041229
11/15/15 01:20 PM
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I figured you did, but wasn't sure.


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Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041251
11/15/15 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted By: petert
this version of the file is not compatible with the version of the Windows which you are running

When are you getting that message? Is it when you attempt to install VMware Player or when you attempt to install Windows 98?

If you are trying to install Windows 98 directly in Windows 7, you might get that message -- and you should thank Windows 7 for preventing you from making a horrible mistake.

If you are installing Windows 98 inside VMware, I can think of two possibilities --

One is that the current, most recent version of VMware Player automatically creates a 64-bit guest VM, which is not what you want to do if your guest OS is Windows 98. (OS = Operating System)

Alternatively, when creating a virtual machine (VM) to install Windows 98 on, you may at some point have been prompted to create a 64-bit guest -- which is not what you want to do since Windows 98 is a 32-bit operating system. Although 32-bit Windows should be able to install on an actual 64-bit computer (i.e. - a computer with a 64-bit processor), it might work differently when installing on a VM.

If you didn't create a VM inside VMware Player before attempting to install Windows 98, you might get that message. It would be similar to installing Windows 98 when you don't have a computer. You have to create the virtual computer (the VM) before installing Windows 98 on it.

It's been years since I used VMware Player so I don't know if the current version will automatically detect your guest OS. VMware Workstation ($$$$$) and VMware Fusion (for Mac) will, but I don't know about Player. You might check a video on how to install Windows 98 on VMware and see if there's something you're not doing. Perhaps one of these...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihDQaYquLrA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KV8jm0oqZfI


Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041260
11/15/15 04:58 PM
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Thank you for the assistance, but I am still flummoxed. As regards the VMware situation, the situation is as follows.

I install VMware Player via the Installation Wizard.
I click on 'VMware Player setup'
I see 'Setup Wizard Complete'
I restart and get 'Welcome to VMware Player'
I click on 'Create a New Virtual Machine' and get a 'New Virtual Machine Wizard'.

I then 'Install from Installer disk'
I put the W98 disk in the drive.
I then 'Select a Guest Operating System' and check Windows 98.
Then I get 'Ready to create Virtual Machine'

Then I check 'Play Virtual Machine'
I am then invited to 'Download VMware tools for W95,W98,Me and NT' - which I assume I need - and then the sky falls in.

I get 'Install of VMware Tools failed. Contact VMware support or your System Administrator' - which I assume is me.

In George Orwellspeak, I am doubleplus upflummoxed.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041264
11/15/15 06:15 PM
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Check out post #5 in the thread below -

"Install of VMware Tools for Window...strator."

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041271
11/15/15 06:39 PM
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So you need to use that iso for VMware Tools that you download ***here*** instead of the one that comes with VMware? Wonder why they supply the wrong one.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: Jenny100] #1041274
11/15/15 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted By: Jenny100
So you need to use that iso for VMware Tools that you download ***here*** instead of the one that comes with VMware? Wonder why they supply the wrong one.


I'd set my VM's up so long ago I'd forgotten - I had to download another ISO (which I still have somewhere) and install it. They no longer provide VMware Tools for the older versions of Windows.

You'll run into similar issues for Sound and Video drivers, they're hard to come by these days. It's a lot of work, but if you're persistent you can locate them.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041293
11/15/15 09:29 PM
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The emulated sound card in the version of VMware I used a year ago was the Sound Blaster Audio PCI. I think earlier versions of VMware Player allowed you to choose Sound Blaster 16 by editing the vmx file for the VM.

I never got the emulated AudioPCI to work right with midi (at best it would play, but had an annoying buzzing sound). Other types of sound seemed to work. I think there may have been a problem with midi in Virtual PC too.

The SBPCI_WebDrvsV5_12_01.exe driver worked for Windows 98SE in VMware but not Windows 95. If you go to the Creative website, you can find this driver if you look up drivers for Windows 98SE and AudioPCI. (be sure to look for Windows 98SE and not Windows 98)

I don't remember what the emulated video card was. I thought it was a special "VMware" card that got its drivers from the tools.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: Draclvr] #1041310
11/16/15 01:02 AM
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Originally Posted By: Draclvr
SharonB, were you asking if you need a 98SE key to install on VPC? I was curious too.


Yes, Draclvr, I was. I have to purchase a new 98SE OS and was confused by the fact that some came with keys and some didn't. (Looked on Ebay.)

Anything else I should look for?

Sharon

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: SharonB] #1041354
11/16/15 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted By: SharonB
[quote=Draclvr]
Anything else I should look for?

OEM versions of Windows 98SE may have bootable CD's.
The boxed retail version does not, and will require a boot floppy or mounting a floppy image.
You can get a floppy image ***here*** however it is an extra step.

Instructions for Windows 98 on Virtual PC 2007 ***here***
and are similar to instructions for Windows 98 on Virtual PC 2004 here on Gameboomers
http://www.gameboomers.com/Members/virtual_pc_2004_faq.htm

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041418
11/16/15 05:58 PM
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Once you the get a successful VM installed, peruse to the location the machine was defined in (usually a sub folder in My Documents) and copy the .VHD (Right click - Copy, Right click Paste). It save a lot of time if you manage to corrupt the original install, you can just rename the files and avoid reloading the entire OS.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: InlandAZ] #1041439
11/16/15 10:40 PM
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Thank you Jenny and Inland. I'll know better now what I'm looking for and will probably save myself from some future hassle.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041502
11/17/15 12:42 PM
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I have tried and failed with Virtual PC and with VMware.
I did download the iso for VMware tools and couldn't work out how to integrate it into the VMware program download.
I had imagined that I could drag and drop the iso(whatever that is) into the file location for the program, but could not manage to make it work.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041508
11/17/15 01:17 PM
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I have no idea, but the ISO is an image file and hopefully Jenny or Inland can help you figure this out.


Once again, weeds are my life!
Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041527
11/17/15 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted By: petert
I have tried and failed with Virtual PC and with VMware.
I did download the iso for VMware tools and couldn't work out how to integrate it into the VMware program download.
I had imagined that I could drag and drop the iso(whatever that is) into the file location for the program, but could not manage to make it work.

petert


Once the VM starts, click Player (upper left hand corner), Removable Devices, CD/DVD, Settings. In the Connection panel enter "Use ISO Image file" and browse to the ISO you downloaded. Press OK and the the install should start.

You'll only need to do this once.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041547
11/17/15 05:21 PM
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I regret that I Am Not Doing At All Well.
I have got the VM icon on my desktop and then I click on Open a Virtual Machine.

I finally got up the screen that I needed to go through the list that you gave me, through to browsing the iso which I had downloaded - and which seemed to installed into the correct slot, but pressing OK then takes me back to a black screen which invites me to 'Install Tools' which turned out to be the same tools which failed to download yesterday.

Grrrrr!!

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041561
11/17/15 06:05 PM
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How frustrating!


Once again, weeds are my life!
Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041565
11/17/15 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted By: petert
I regret that I Am Not Doing At All Well.
I have got the VM icon on my desktop and then I click on Open a Virtual Machine.

I finally got up the screen that I needed to go through the list that you gave me, through to browsing the iso which I had downloaded - and which seemed to installed into the correct slot, but pressing OK then takes me back to a black screen which invites me to 'Install Tools' which turned out to be the same tools which failed to download yesterday.

Try to locate where the bad VMware Tools iso is on your hard drive, delete it, and replace it with the good version that you downloaded.
You may need to rename the good version so it has exactly the same name as the bad version -- I'm not sure of that. See if that helps.

If the current version of VMware Player continues to be a PITA, try an older version
http://www.oldapps.com/VMware_player.php

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041566
11/17/15 06:27 PM
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Is that ISO you downloaded 29MB? If not, you're pointing to the wrong file.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041704
11/18/15 05:54 PM
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The iso is the correct one, but I am unable to make the VM program run.

Over the next few days I will clear every VM item off the computer and decide if I want to try again.

Thanks to everyone who tried to help.

petert

+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+

Nov. 19

OK, so I am a glutton for punishment. I think I have made a little progress but have come to a halt again.

Virtual PC
I have a screen which is 'New Virtual Machine Microsoft Virtual PC2007' which is showing
'Reboot and Select proper boot device
or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device'

What do I do now?

(I will have another go at VMware if I cannot get Virtual PC going)

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041808
11/19/15 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted By: petert
Virtual PC
I have a screen which is 'New Virtual Machine Microsoft Virtual PC2007' which is showing
'Reboot and Select proper boot device
or Insert Boot Media in selected boot device'

What do I do now?

When it says "reboot" it is not talking about your main computer.
It is talking about rebooting the virtual machine so it can boot off the Windows 98 CD (or iso of the Windows 98 CD).
If your Windows 98 CD is not bootable, you'll have to boot off a floppy or floppy image.
Check the "If you can't boot Windows 98 from CD" section ***here***.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041813
11/19/15 01:56 PM
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I recall when Steve ran into this issue, I was unaware of it as well. He did an excellent job of writing it up, just follow his advice and you'll be up and running in no time.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041921
11/20/15 11:56 AM
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In the immortal words of Jim Lovell, we have a problem.

I do remember Metzomagic's instructions on installing W98 into my old XP machine (which I still have and still works in W98 in Virtual PC - though it is ailing) but I find that my current Windows 7 machine says that it cannot find the win98se.image file. And I can't find it, either.

Is there anything I can do to transfer/copy the Virtual PC from my old XP machine to the Windows 7 machine?

Failing that, is there an easy solution to finding the .image file, so that I can carry on with Metzo's instructions to install VirtualPC into the W7 machine.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041928
11/20/15 01:12 PM
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You sure can, I do it all the time. Copy the files (.VHD & .VMC) from the XP box. If you've got a large enough thumb drive you can use that, or set up a workgroup share and transfer them over your WiFi.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041932
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Is it OK to copy VirtualPC to a CD and do it that way?

I don't know how to set up a workgroup share.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041934
11/20/15 01:47 PM
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Yep, you can do it that way as well.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1041942
11/20/15 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted By: petert
Is it OK to copy VirtualPC to a CD and do it that way?

When you copy to CD, the files turn into read-only, which can cause a problem when running them.

Better to zip the files before copying them to CD. It doesn't matter if a zip file is read-only.

Alternatively you have to remember to remove the read-only attribute after copying them back to your hard drive.

It's quicker and easier to copy to a USB flash drive.

+_+_+_+_+_+

Assuming you have actually created a VirtualPC virtual machine on Windows 7x64, look for the .vhd and .vmc files in
C:\Users\<your-username>\Documents\My Virtual Machines\<whatever-you-named-your-virtual-machine>\

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042058
11/21/15 08:39 AM
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Progress - of a sort.

I used a WD drive to transfer the Virtual PC to the Windows 7 laptop, But now the machine tells me that 'Virtual PC cannot be installed under 64 bit operating system. Please try again under a 32 bit system'.

Is this something that I should be able to do? Note that the virtual PC is the 2004 version.

I feel that I must be becoming a pain in the nether regions.
petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042077
11/21/15 11:12 AM
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The 2004 version won't work on Windows 7.
You need to get the 2007 version for Windows 7 -- and since your Win7 is 64bit, you need the 64bit version of Virtual PC.

See if you can get it ***here***.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042193
11/22/15 08:33 AM
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I seem to have come full circle with this exercise.

I could not get VirtualPC (the 2007 version) to accept the Windows 98 system, due to some insurmountable compatibility problem, and I had a similar sort of problem with VMware.

So I'll take the machine to me local tech wizard, who will shake his head at my obvious incompetence and figure out the solution in a flash.

It says here.

Thanks for all the advice, but I can't waste any more of your time - or mine, come to that - trying to get it all working.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042214
11/22/15 11:28 AM
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I wonder if the problem is related to the fdisk (partitioning) and formatting steps.
If you're not already familiar with how to do those steps with Windows 98 on a physical computer, you might run into problems there. Windows 98 won't install until you create partitions and format them to its liking, and you have to reboot the VM between the fdisk and formatting steps. Maybe a YouTube video like this one would help.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wi3BcSYnw7M

fdisk instructions (with pictures) here
http://www.wikihow.com/Use-the-Fdisk-Tool-and-the-Format-Tool-to-Partition-a-Hard-Drive

Also do not use "Windows Virtual PC".
It is different from Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 and 2007 SP1.
Windows Virtual PC has removed support for Windows 98 and any Windows operating system earlier than XP, so is worthless. Check the Wikipedia for more information.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virtual_PC_2007#Microsoft_Virtual_PC

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042481
11/24/15 01:19 PM
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I went to see my expert bloke, who installed Oracle VirtualBox and then installed my W98 and XP operating systems.
So I have the (alleged)ability to run the old games. So far, I have not have great success in either OS, but I live in hope of being able to do so.

Stand by for a whole new set of queries from me relating to Oracle VB!

petert

Query 1

When I try to run a game in W98, I get the message that the game requires a minimum of 256 colors, but when I right click on the desktop, I see that I can only have 16 colors - the only alternative in the menu is 2 colors.

I am told that I need to find 'Windows set up' to achieve my aim, but I cannot see how to get this up. Can you help?

petert

Last edited by petert; 11/24/15 02:45 PM. Reason: new info
Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042513
11/24/15 04:41 PM
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I don't believe Virtual Box provides support for Windows 98, so you'll have to try something like Sci-Tech Display Doctor (or UniVBE) to enable higher color depth.

They released their last version as freeware sometime ago - but I no longer see it available. You can try the link below, but I can't vouch for it being free of malware.


SDD V7 Download

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042517
11/24/15 05:43 PM
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My experience using VirtualBox with Windows 98 and Sci-Tech Display Doctor v7 was that it was terribly unstable and froze nearly all the time. If you want to use VirtualBox, put Windows XP inside it.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042528
11/24/15 07:07 PM
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Yep, I was never impressed with Virtual Box at all. Some like it, but never got it to work as well as VMware.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: InlandAZ] #1042787
11/26/15 02:47 PM
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I got Win 98SE and installed it. It took 3 tries to get it right. However... After a couple minutes I started having problems with the mouse. I was able to install Dark Side of the Moon and get it working for a couple minutes then it locked up on me. After having trouble with the start button as well, I decided to install the VM additions. Then my mouse behaved better and my start button responded correctly. But I can't play DSOM. I don't know what the trouble is. Any ideas? crazy

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042798
11/26/15 04:27 PM
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Yes, installing a compatible version of VMware Tools is a must. There are couple of patches mentioned in the link below (which still seem to be available) - you might want to give them a shot.

Game crashes still. HELP

Look for Winterfury's post on the last page of the thread.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: SharonB] #1042801
11/26/15 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted By: SharonB
I got Win 98SE and installed it. It took 3 tries to get it right.

Which did you install in?
VMware Player?
VirtualBox?
Virtual PC 2007?

As I said before, I had no luck with Windows 95 or 98 in VirtualBox.
It kept freezing and was no good for anything. If a game works in XP, you could try installing XP in VirtualBox.

On Windows 7, I think Virtual PC 2007 is your best bet, and it's possible Virtual PC 2007 SP1 version works better on 64-bit Windows 7 than the original Virtual PC 2007.

If you have Windows 8 or 8.1, you may need VMware, but you'd probably be better off with an older version that supports a Windows 98 guest OS.

Originally Posted By: InlandAZ
Yes, installing a compatible version of VMware Tools is a must. There are couple of patches mentioned in the link below (which still seem to be available) - you might want to give them a shot.

Game crashes still. HELP

Look for Winterfury's post on the last page of the thread.

I think those fixes are only for installing on XP, not a Windows 98 VM.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042819
11/26/15 09:33 PM
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Quote:
I think those fixes are only for installing on XP, not a Windows 98 VM.


I wasn't sure which OS it was for, so maybe. I ran the game without issues under VPC 2007, but I don't recall if it was 98 or XP.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: InlandAZ] #1042826
11/26/15 10:31 PM
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I'm running Win 98SE under Virtual PC 2007. I downloaded the video fix, but I don't know what to do with it.

Another question -- When I turn off Virtual PC, do I need to release the DVD drive?

The problem I'm having now getting DSOM to run is that it either doesn't recognize the dvd is in the drive or I just get a black screen.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042835
11/26/15 11:24 PM
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From Winterfury's Post#23 at
http://archive.adventuregamers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3837&page=2

the video fix does the same thing as reducing video acceleration in Windows 98, only it does it only for the game and not the whole of Windows 98. The advantage of the video fix is that you aren't reducing video acceleration for any other games you're running in your Windows 98 virtual machine. The disadvantage is that you have to get the patched xvideoio.dll into your virtual machine.

Directions for what to do with the xvideoio.dll are in that Post#23. You have to put it into the DSOM\bin folder (first rename the xvideoio.dll file that is already in the DSOM\bin folder to prevent overwriting it).

If you're able to access the patched file using Windows 98, that's not such a problem. But there can be problems accessing download sites with old versions of IE. In the past I've had to use one of these solutions:

1. Download an old version of Firefox that works with both Windows 98 and the download site for the patch

2. Download the patch onto my main computer, use Imgburn to convert the patch to an iso file, Start Virtual PC, mount the iso file in Virtual PC instead of my physical CD/DVD drive, copy the patch from what Windows 98 thinks is the D: drive to what Windows 98 thinks is the hard drive, and switch from the mounted iso back to the physical CD/DVD drive.

You can see why it might be easier to try reducing video (aka hardware) acceleration in Windows 98. I don't remember exactly how to do it and don't have Windows 98 in front of me at the moment. I found these instructions on the Internet
http://www.techadvice.com/w98/errors/2/er_00121.htm
Quote:

How to Adjust the video acceleration in Windows 98 -

Right click My Computer icon on the desktop
select properties
click the performance tab on the top of the window
Click the graphics button on the button of the screen
you will now see a slide bar.
click on the bar and move it all the way to the left
click the OK button repeatedly until the window closes
then reboot the computer.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1042890
11/27/15 12:39 PM
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Quote:
You can see why it might be easier to try reducing video (aka hardware) acceleration in Windows 98. I don't remember exactly how to do it and don't have Windows 98 in front of me at the moment. I found these instructions on the Internet


That's an easy one - Control Panel -> Display Settings -> Advanced -> Performance Tab. You'll see the slider control to lower the hardware acceleration.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043070
11/29/15 01:14 AM
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I've got to ask, in laymans terms, what is VMWare? What do you use it for? duh


When you live in the past, it costs you the present.
Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: InlandAZ] #1043071
11/29/15 01:48 AM
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Well, progress was made. After turning the graphics acceleration off, I was able to see the game and make some headway into the introductory movie. Then it froze saying "unrecoverable process error. Will now reset."

Thank you both for getting me this far. I wonder if tweaking the graphics performance will make any difference. Do you think I need to reset the audio performance?

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: SharonB] #1043098
11/29/15 11:14 AM
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Originally Posted By: SharonB
Do you think I need to reset the audio performance?

It's possible. I remember I had to turn audio acceleration to none to prevent crashes in some games back when my game computer used Windows 98.
Click the Start button in Win98
Click Run
type the word
dxdiag
in the box and OK it
Choose the Sound tab
Move the slidebar to the left and OK it.
I don't remember if you have to reboot.

There may be a CPU speed problem if your computer has hardware virtualization enabled in the BIOS. Hardware virtualization makes virtual computers run much faster, which is not desirable when you're trying to emulate a 200 MHz computer for an old game from the 1990's.

Originally Posted By: Terri824
I've got to ask, in laymans terms, what is VMWare? What do you use it for?

It is virtual computer software, like Virtual PC and VirtualBox.
You use it to run a different operating system (in this case a different version of Windows) on your main computer inside of VMware.
VMware Player is the free version.
VMware Workstation is the pay version for PC.
VMware Fusion is the version for Macs.
Unfortunately the current version of VMware Player does not support Windows 98.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043111
11/29/15 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Unfortunately the current version of VMware Player does not support Windows 98.


No, but the 2004 VM Additions did - I have it if anyone is interested. According to the VMware folks it's perfectly legal to distribute it.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043196
11/30/15 12:52 AM
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Thanks so much Jenny. wave That's sort of what I gathered by the posts but wasn't quite sure. I might have to check it out.


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Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043487
12/02/15 06:33 AM
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I tried over and over again to get W98 to work on a variety of programs - Virtual PC, Oracle VirtualBox and VMware - but finally admitted that my brain was not up to the task. So I fired up my old W98 computer and am steadily re-running my old games for the last time before the old machine gives up the ghost


I am grateful for all the advice and help that I received during my attempts, but it is clear that I am unable to achieve my end aim.

I do have XP sort of available in Oracle VirtualBox so I can run any of the old XP games that will not run easily on Windows 7. Surprisingly enough, quite a few of these will run on Windows 7 - Syberia 1 and 2 and Lost Horizon to name but 3 - so the time has come to move forwards. There must more games like those three available, and perhaps GBs can point me towards those?

Once again, thank you for all the help and advice.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043504
12/02/15 10:12 AM
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You might check the Windows 7 and games thread stickied at the top of the Glitches forum.


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Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043509
12/02/15 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted By: petert
I tried over and over again to get W98 to work on a variety of programs - Virtual PC, Oracle VirtualBox and VMware - but finally admitted that my brain was not up to the task. So I fired up my old W98 computer and am steadily re-running my old games for the last time before the old machine gives up the ghost.

Don't assume your Windows 98 computer is going to give up any time soon. I have computers older than that that still work. The first thing to go wrong is usually the CMOS battery, which can be replaced.

Quote:
I am grateful for all the advice and help that I received during my attempts, but it is clear that I am unable to achieve my end aim.

I am still curious about what the problem is. It seemed like you were able to start the Windows 98 install, but it would not boot to the desktop after installing. Windows 98 should be able to boot to the desktop if you skip having the tools installed.

Quote:
I do have XP sort of available in Oracle VirtualBox so I can run any of the old XP games that will not run easily on Windows 7. Surprisingly enough, quite a few of these will run on Windows 7 - Syberia 1 and 2 and Lost Horizon to name but 3 - so the time has come to move forwards. There must more games like those three available, and perhaps GBs can point me towards those?

If you are asking about older games that run in Windows 7, check the ***Windows 7 and Games thread*** that was started by Draclvr.

Syberia has been reissued for Windows 7 and later, so even if the original does not work it's easy to play in Windows 7.
Lost Horizon was published in 2010 so it supported Windows 7 to start with (lists XP, Vista, and Windows 7 on the box).

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043841
12/04/15 12:51 PM
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Being a pigheaded idiot, I searched the net and found a website containing the snappy title heading of:

"Windows 98SE on Virtual PC 2007 X64 on Windows 7 Professional 64 bits". I downloaded this and, to be fair, had some success.

I downloaded the Virtual PC program, extracted the Virtual PC files, clicked on "setup.exe", and then the installation was complete.

I then clicked on "Virtual Disk Wizard" and selected the option to create a virtual hard disk, and then typed in "C:\win98_virtual.vhd".
I selected 'Dynamically Expanding' option, set up the VHD limit, and so far so good.

I clicked on the File menu in the Virtual PC window and selected "New Virtual Machine Wizard", selected "Create a Virtual Machine", chose a virtual machine name and directory, and then selected Windows 98, and then "Using the recommended RAM".
I selected "An existing Virtual Hard Disk", and , from the Browse button, selected the virtual hard drive I had set up.

But then the problem started

The instruction in the website asked me to download the "Win 98 Boot floppy" from the 'Resources section below', but there ain't no resources section.


I did download a 'Win 98 Boot Floppy, and tried to use that but the instructions in the web
site that I started from were then to "Drag and Drop 'Win 98 Boot Floppy' into the Virtual
Machine window".

But it won't go.
When I try to drag the unzipped floppy into the Virtual Machine window, I get the "No Entry" sign.

Maybe I should have stuck with my original plan to use the old W98 machine - which I am still using - but it annoys me that do not have enough nous to work out what I am doing wrong.

petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043855
12/04/15 02:58 PM
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Use Steve's instructions for a non-bootable install - download the file he mentions, and you should be fine.

If you can't boot Windows 98 from CD - Download the img file in this section.


Quote:

If you can't boot Windows 98 from CD
If your Windows 98 CD isn't bootable, then we're going to have to boot from a (virtual!) floppy, much like the process we use to install Windows 95. Just save this win98se.img file to your XP hard drive. Then follow the steps below to install Windows 98 to your virtual machine.

1.Insert the Windows 98 CD in your CD/DVD drive
2.On the Virtual PC console, select the virtual machine you have created for Windows 98 and hit the Start button
3.The first time you bring up this new virtual machine, you get the following error message:

Reboot and Select proper Boot device
or Insert Boot Media in selected Boot device



4.Not so fast. First, while we're here, we capture the CD for subsequent reboots. On the virtual machine menu: CD -> Use Physical Drive D: (or whatever the letter is of your CD-ROM drive)
5.Then, we capture the win98se.img file from where ever you saved it to on your XP hard drive via: Floppy -> Capture Floppy Disk Image...
6.Now reboot the virtual machine via: Action -> Ctrl+Alt+Del
7.Your virtual machine should boot off the floppy image, and you eventually wind up at the A:\> prompt :-) For future reference, note which drive letter the CD-ROM has been mapped to. Mine was D: (you see something like: Drive D: = Driver MSCD001 unit 0)

Next, we create a primary DOS partition:


8.At the A:\> prompt, enter: fdisk
9.Do you wish to enable large disk support (Y/N)..............? [Y]
Choose: 1. Create DOS partition or Logical DOS Drive
10.Choose: 1. Create Primary DOS partition
11.Do you wish to use the maximum available size for a Primary DOS Partition
and make the partition active (Y/N).....................? [Y]
12.You get a message that: You MUST restart your system for your changes to take effect.
13.So... Press Esc to exit FDISK, then from the virtual machine Action menu, select: Ctrl+Alt+Del (you boot again from the floppy image)
14.When your virtual machine boots this time, choose: 1. Start computer with CD-ROM support.
(again, note which letter your CD-ROM drive has been mapped to. Mine changed from D to E here)

Now we format the DOS partition:


15.Now comes the really fun part, and your trust factor has to be high for this :-)
At the A:\> prompt, enter: format c:
(the virtual 16MB primary DOS partition you just created will be formatted in FAT32 format)
16.After that, just hit Enter to accept a blank volume label. Now we're ready to install Windows 98 to the virtual machine you have created. Don't worry that you only allocated and formatted a 16MB primary DOS partition. The virtual machine hard disk you created is *expandable*, and will take anything you can subsequently throw at it :-)

Install Windows 98:


17.Now remember which drive letter your CD-ROM is mapped to, and switch to there via entering something like: e:
18.Begin installing Windows 98 by entering: setup
(allow ScanDisk to run, then the Windows 98 install 'splash' screen comes up)
19.When prompted, DON'T create a startup disk
20.The very first time you're asked to restart the computer, go to the virtual machine menu (remember, hold down Right+Alt and then move your cursor). Choose: Floppy -> Release "win98se.img". This way, when the virtual machine reboots, it will now boot off the hard drive rather than the floppy image!
21.Windows 98 should now boot from the virtual machine hard drive. Each time you're susequently asked to restart the machine during the installation process, choose option 1 to boot from the hard drive (instead of the CD).
22.Bear with it for a few more restarts, and finally you should have Windows 98 up and running :-)

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1043874
12/04/15 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted By: petert
I did download a 'Win 98 Boot Floppy, and tried to use that but the instructions in the web site that I started from were then to "Drag and Drop 'Win 98 Boot Floppy' into the Virtual
Machine window".

But it won't go.
I've never tried to "Drag and Drop" a floppy image onto Virtual PC. I use the Virtual PC menu to add the floppy image (Floppy --> Capture Floppy Disk Image... ).
Also I use the floppy image that's linked to on the ***Metzomagic webpage*** (the one Inland linked to). The direct link to the floppy image is here
http://www.metzomagic.com/Help/download/win98se.img

Originally Posted By: petert
Maybe I should have stuck with my original plan to use the old W98 machine - which I am still using - but it annoys me that do not have enough nous to work out what I am doing wrong.

It's harder to install Windows 98SE if the CD is not bootable.
If the CD is bootable, you don't have to mess with the floppy image -- just boot directly off the CD.

There are advantages to using an old computer with Windows 98SE installed instead of in a Virtual Machine on a fast new computer -- less chance of the computer being too fast for the game.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1044623
12/09/15 06:24 AM
12/09/15 06:24 AM
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Hampshire, UK
petert Offline OP
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petert  Offline OP
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Well, how about that.
I finally got W98 to run inside Virtual PC on Windows 7, thanks to the advice and the invaluable assistance of Jenny100 and InlandAZ. Thank you also for your patience.

I did download the win98se.img from the internet, but it did not seem that I needed it. When I followed Metzomagic's detailed instructions, the W98 program seemed to load from the CD without recourse to any requirement to look for the floppy. Perhaps, because my W98 disk was not the SE version, the installation booted from the CD.

Anyway, I am most grateful for the help.



petert

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1044656
12/09/15 10:39 AM
12/09/15 10:39 AM
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Draclvr Offline
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Persistence pays off! So what is the first game you are going to play?


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Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1044658
12/09/15 11:27 AM
12/09/15 11:27 AM
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southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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Originally Posted By: petert
Perhaps, because my W98 disk was not the SE version, the installation booted from the CD.

Some Windows 98 CD's are bootable and some are not.
It's not related to whether they are FE (first edition) or SE.
Retail boxed versions don't seem to be bootable.
The OEM versions I've tried (those labelled "for system builders") have all been bootable, however there may be some that aren't.

Anyway, glad to hear you got it working.
Be sure to back it up.
Copy the .vhd and .vmc files that are in your "My Virtual Machines" folder (or copy the folder they are on) to some other location on your hard drive so they can be easily copied back and restored.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1044951
12/11/15 01:01 PM
12/11/15 01:01 PM
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Hampshire, UK
petert Offline OP
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Have backed up the files - thanks for the tip.

Thought I would try Mystery of the Nautilus because it used to work well in W98 in VirtualPC on my old XP machine, but when loading it in I was asked to load DirectX, But I cannot access the internet from the W98 machine which is running on the Windows7 machine. Presumably there is a way that I can get DirectX from the W7 machine into the W98 program?

petert

Last edited by petert; 12/11/15 01:06 PM. Reason: Clarification of problem
Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1045027
12/11/15 09:20 PM
12/11/15 09:20 PM
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Posts: 7,263
Arizona
InlandAZ Offline
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There are several ways to get DirectX on the VM.

1) Enable Networking on the VM (not recommended)
2) Enable Folder Sharing in the VM and install it from the host
3) Run the VM in a Window and Drag and Drop the DirectX executable from the host to the Desktop of the VM.

Option 3 is probably the best choice.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1045033
12/11/15 10:26 PM
12/11/15 10:26 PM
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southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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southeast USA
I think the original Mystery of the Nautilus used DirectX 8, probably one of these
http://www.oldapps.com/directx.php?old_directx=4
http://www.oldapps.com/directx.php?old_directx=3

I think it also needed a newer version of Windows Media Player than what Windows 98 shipped with -- maybe version 7?
http://www.oldapps.com/windows_media_player.php?old_windows_media_player=5

Sometimes the game CD includes the version of DirectX the game needs in a separate folder. Check your game CD. If it's there, that's the easiest way.

Re: Virtual PC and VMware [Re: petert] #1045139
12/12/15 05:01 PM
12/12/15 05:01 PM
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Hampshire, UK
petert Offline OP
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Started running the game, whereupon it seems to start OK: nothing about installing DirectX.

Shall continue.

petert

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