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#301565 - 03/28/08 01:59 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers!
seagul Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 194
Loc: Germany
Since english is not my native tongue, I may have missed some clues in the lost crown.
I hope someone can tell me if the following thoughts are right:
Click to reveal..
Nigel never left the Hadden-Building. He became (thanks to Mr. Haddens interference) part of an experiment, in which he is transported to an dreamlike land. Here it is his job to redeem some of the ghost that live in Saxton.
He works since 1978 for Hadden Industries (see Prologue), Lucy works since 2008 – they never met in real live as to young people to solve the riddles of Saxton!

What I don’ t comprehend is (among a million other things): why is Mr. Gruel so obsessed by Jemima, the Paperdoll?
Click to reveal..
I understood that his wife was named Jemima. What happened to her?
I’m sure he follows Nigel and Lucy because he knows they are “real” people. He seems to be possesed or bewitched by Frederick Ager, who created the nigthmare room by using the blood of poor animals.
But Jemima…?


Edited by seagul (03/28/08 02:00 PM)

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#301603 - 03/28/08 03:29 PM Re: Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: seagul]
misa Offline
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 1372
Loc: PA, USA
seagul, very interesting observactions.

For your first point, I'm still trying to figure that all out in my head. I think I need to replay the game to reabsorb everything again.

I replayed the prologue and

Click to reveal..
You're right, Nigel was recruited in 1978. Just how old is he anyway? And Hadden does say something to the effect that Nigel is going "nowhere"... I have not played Dark Fall (yet) but I do know that Nigel is a university student in it? Another thing is that Hadden tells Lucy to bring back Nigel. From what? From an experiment? Seance?


As for Jemima,

Click to reveal..
I assume that Gruel was traumatised after Jemima's death and therefore started thinking/believing that the doll was his wife? Maybe he got into the whole Ager thing to try and resurrect Jemima?


And also...

Click to reveal..
How many of the residents were real and how many were ghosts? Were the Katherine & Robert Karswell and Nancy & Timmy the only ghosts that appeared real to Nigel? Or were there more?


So many questions, but questions in a good way. I really need to replay this and pay more attention! I'd love to hear other people's thoughts as well!

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#301630 - 03/28/08 04:29 PM Re: Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: misa]
seagul Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 194
Loc: Germany
I feel reliefed that even native english speakers are left with a number of unanswered questions after finishing the game. The story has so many subplots and bypaths- the fun is not over after playing it! bravo
Interesting thoughts, misa.
I, too, wondered about Mr. Hadden
Click to reveal..
saying that Lucy has to pull back Nigel, when the time is right - what does he mean?

Your thoughts about Jemima:
Click to reveal..
they sound possible, but are there some hints in the game? I found nothing specific.

I belief, the people Nigel meets in Saxton
Click to reveal..
are all ghost - except Lucy. But than -what about Alex, Lucys brother? Saxton lies in the sixties, Lucy and Alex should not live there, but in a modern Saxton. Are there only parts of Saxton involved in the experiment?

I never understood what happend to
Click to reveal..
the little girl in the museum. Couldn't Nigel redeem her, because her beeing a ghost was not connected to the Ager-brothers?





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#301638 - 03/28/08 04:45 PM Re: Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: seagul]
misa Offline
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 1372
Loc: PA, USA
I really do hope that Jonathan Boakes considers writing a novel based on his screenplay for the game. I'd definitely buy it!

Hadden:

Click to reveal..
Yes, I am not quite sure what Hadden means about pulling Nigel back and whether it's from an experiment or a seance or what!


Jemima:

Click to reveal..
I didn't see anything in the game about my theory but just an assumption based on knowing that sometimes grief can cause people's realities to shatter and shift. Also the concept of going the route of evil (creating the nightmare room) to resurrect a loved one is a common theme in fiction so... that's what I assumed he was doing. But only Jonathan knows for sure!


People of Saxton:

Click to reveal..
I got that impression as well that everyone was a ghost except Lucy and Alex. Though Alex could have been just a part of the "experiment" if Nigel was in an experiment. Did you notice that Alex's handheld device was from the Hadden corporation? Or maybe just some were real ghosts and some were part of the experiment. Like the little boy with the camera. The camera he was using was a digital camera.


As for the girl in the museum:

Click to reveal..
I don't think she needed to be saved. She had stated that she was there of her own free will and wasn't trapped and that she went to the museum often to play. Maybe she didn't know she was dead and still thought she was playing there because I do remember Nigel finding the newspaper article about her death.


Still so many questions. smile

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#301662 - 03/28/08 05:35 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: Jenny100]
Darleen03 Offline
Adept Boomer

Registered: 12/13/03
Posts: 14672
Loc: Northeast NJ
I couldn't understand what to do with
Click to reveal..
With the pig..I keep running back & forth to feed him pizza & sandwiches..Only to find out later he was a meal & nothing more rotfl

That part made me cry also cry
_________________________
Luv Dar


GameBoomers
"Games Are More Enticing Because Of Our "MaG"nificent Efficient Radiant Site"

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#301666 - 03/28/08 05:53 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: Darleen03]
seagul Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 194
Loc: Germany
I wonder if every
Click to reveal..
MayDayPig has the same name: Cairan.
I cried, too. cry
How can someone give an animal a name and than kill it??

I was so reliefed when
Click to reveal..
Mr. Tibbs was found alive. catrub

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#301810 - 03/29/08 06:29 AM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: seagul]
old lady Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 05/17/06
Posts: 582
Loc: cornwall england
Well, knock me down with a feather eek i have to admit that I missed the subplot.
_________________________
Has any one seen any little gray cells around as I think I've lost some? Reward for finder.

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#301855 - 03/29/08 08:44 AM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: old lady]
misa Offline
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 1372
Loc: PA, USA
Just thought of something else!

At the end:

Click to reveal..
Didn't Hadden have the Saxon warrior helmet on his desk? Is that another indication that this was partially or all an engineered experiment?

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#301926 - 03/29/08 11:27 AM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: misa]
seagul Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 194
Loc: Germany
scared
Misa, I did miss this! It gives the story a new sense! It could explain why Nigel is from the start focused on finding the crown.
Click to reveal..
The Ager brothers are perverted by the power the crown gave to them. It started with Thomas, who made a pact with his brothers to bring harm to anybody who tries to uncover the crown. The idea of saving the land and the poeple by saving the crown is perverted by the Ager brothers: they kill innocent people to save the crown. What is if someone has to replace the Ager brothers and do what the real keepers of the crown are supposed to do? Mr Hadden could be the one - and Nigel, who infiltrated his experiment, could be his tool.

Hmm, I should restart the game to look out for some hints in this direction.

Btw: sorry for my bad english, I hope everybody can understand me. oops

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#301939 - 03/29/08 11:47 AM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: seagul]
misa Offline
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 1372
Loc: PA, USA
seagul, I think you're on to something! I think we both need to replay to fully explore the entire story again. smile

(and your English is excellent!)

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#301986 - 03/29/08 01:39 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: misa]
Jenny100 Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 10/24/00
Posts: 35157
Loc: southeast USA
What manner of place is Saxton?
Click to reveal..
I think a combination of ghost-related phenomena are involved, including time slips and possibly stone tape theory for some of the manifestations. Nigel's visit to Katherine and Robert Karswell at the Ager house clearly seems to be part of a time slip. Producing conditions that would cause a time slip (or other ghost-related manifestations) would probably be what Haddon Industries was investigating.

For those who don't know what time slips are, check the story about Annie Moberly and Dr. Eleanor Frances Jourdain, found here
http://members.aol.com/timeslip8888/versailles.html

Another timeslip is recounted here
http://www.assap.org/newsite/articles/Time%20slip.html

Another interesting website which describes various types of ghost-related phenomena is here
http://www.ghostclub.org.uk/spring2007.htm



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#301994 - 03/29/08 01:55 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: Jenny100]
misa Offline
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 1372
Loc: PA, USA
Jenny, thanks for the information and what you've proposed does makes sense.

Click to reveal..
Now would the timeslips in certain general areas in the game be indicated by that "photo tear"? I remember it appearing at Northfield which is close to the Karswell home and it was somewhere else -- was it the other church?

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#302039 - 03/29/08 03:25 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: misa]
Jenny100 Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 10/24/00
Posts: 35157
Loc: southeast USA
Click to reveal..
I noticed one tear at the tree (yew tree?) at Northfield church and the other at Ulcombe Church. Interesting how both of them were near churches. I'm not sure what the tears indicated.

The most obvious time slip was the one at the Ager house, and that didn't have any tears that were very near to it. Instead the tears seemed close to where two of the Ager brothers (Thomas and Nathaniel) had the most power. Maybe it was because of the proximity of evil to what were supposed to be holy places. Otherwise I'd have expected a tear at the Net House and maybe also at Harbor Cottage (where there were similar manifestations of evil black vapor).

Anyway, the time slip at the Ager house didn't seem to have any obvious evil associated with it. Not at the time Nigel visited anyway.

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#302053 - 03/29/08 03:50 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: misa]
seagul Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 05/04/06
Posts: 194
Loc: Germany
Thanks, Jenny, very interesting pages. thanks

I remember two
Click to reveal..
photo tears: at the graveyard by Northfield church an at the Ulcombe church, where Mr. Russett repairs the roof.

(edit: Oh, Jenny 100 just answerd the question!)

But as I understand the Report submitted by Mr. Hare, which Nigel carrys with him
Click to reveal..
the "April Showers" (to which Mr. Hare refers) flooded the Saxton graveyard and opend a chasm to another world. I suppose the "Shadow time" is nine o'clock: the time, the clock at the BEAR is stuck.

I never know if I see to much in every hint. blush
I'm replaying the game and realised,
Click to reveal..
that some people live in the present (the landlady, Alex "Spitmoor", Lucy), some in the past. I must pay attention if the present people know the past people.
I'm not sure, to which group Prof. Hardacre belongs.

Replaying the game reveals many interesting details - it is even more fun than the first time! yay
This is a recommendation to everybody who loved playing it the first time! wave

@ Misa: Thanks for your nice words wave, I' flattered.

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#302064 - 03/29/08 04:30 PM Thoughts about the Story of The Lost Crown – beware of huge spoilers! [Re: seagul]
Jenny100 Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 10/24/00
Posts: 35157
Loc: southeast USA
Originally Posted By: seagul
But as I understand the Report submitted by Mr. Hare, which Nigel carrys with him
Click to reveal..
the "April Showers" (to which Mr. Hare refers) flooded the Saxton graveyard and opened a chasm to another world. I suppose the "Shadow time" is nine o'clock: the time, the clock at the BEAR is stuck.

I'm afraid I didn't understand that entry at all.
Click to reveal..
I took it to mean the flooding was what caused the rotting bodies to be washed up on the beaches and poison the waters. At the beginning of the game, I wondered if the crown had already been stolen, which in turn had caused the disastrous flooding in the first place. The flooding did not seem like a natural event.

I didn't connect it to the clock at the Bear being stuck. I wondered if the Bear, or parts of it, were being seen and/or heard "stone tape style" -- as a replay of a certain moment in the past. Remember how one time Nigel visited the Bear and heard many peoples' voices in the room, but when he entered the room there was no one there.


Quote:
I'm replaying the game and realised,
Click to reveal..
that some people live in the present (the landlady, Alex "Spitmoor", Lucy), some in the past. I must pay attention if the present people know the past people.

Click to reveal..
They seem to. At least they seem to know of them. If they aren't ghosts themselves, they at least seem to be used to living alongside ghosts.


Quote:
Click to reveal..
I'm not sure, to which group Prof. Hardacre belongs.

Click to reveal..
He actually seems to belong to both. Remember there was a Hardacre who warned Nigel at night, out on the Harbour Wall. But when Nigel asks him about it next day, Hardacre doesn't know what he's talking about. Could the Hardacre that Nigel met out on the Harbour Wall be a manifestation from the future? A ghost that came into being after Hardacre was killed? Who killed Hardacre anyway? Was it Gruel or one of the Agers by way of a time slip?

Time seems confused in this game. For example, the ages of the Ager brothers. William Ager died in the 1940's, yet Thomas Ager was rector of Northfield in 1799. And some other characters look younger than events in their pasts would indicate their ages to be. So does that mean those characters are ghosts or are parts of Saxton in a time slip?

What was the significance of Thomas Ager taking Nicholas Gurney's hands and (apparently) deleting the coats of arms from his memorial? That kept Gurney's spirit from moving on and created a puzzle for Nigel. But why would Thomas Ager have bothered? Wouldn't killing him and stealing his money be enough?

And then we can go back to what caused the "April Showers" that caused all those rotting bodies to pollute the waters. Was this the result of the Agers trying to empty out the town?

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