my new laptop has both Intel HD graphics and a dedicated 1 GB NVidia 420M graphics card. The computer is using the HD graphics card, which I tried disabling in order to try to force it to switch to the NVidia card, but it seems that it won't switch over even though I'm keeping the computer's AC power plugged into it at all times - how do I force it to make the switch and save this setting?

I know the laptop was using its HD graphics card b/c when I last tested Alter Ego on it after applying my successful fix (in another thread) to render the invisible game characters fully visible, I saw text at the bottom of the game's menu that said something like "using HD video (low-end graphics)".

I tried looking in the user guide for how to make the switch, but it seems as if I cannot find the instructions. It's a Acer Aspire 5745G laptop.

The only paper-based docs that came was the Quick Guide. I did a quick scan of the .pdf user guide that's on the computer, but didn't find any instructions, and I tried my "P" (programmable) key, but this doesn't work either.

You said you disabled the HD graphics. You shouldn't have done that. You can just switch between the two. But I don't know what the switch is if it isn't in your user's manual or the quick guide.

EDIT: I did find this in a review...

It could be in your power options, mine has quite a few different selections, such as High Performance, Quiet Office. Those might have something to do with what graphics card it uses. Mine has only the NVidia card so I couldn't tell you how it affects switching. Mine also has a one touch button at the top of the keyboard, along with a few others. Try mousing over the taskbar and see what the icons say.

Reading stuff on google it says her machine should switch when plugged into a wall and again when unplugged. Manually you do it with a P button above her keyboard

That's what I read too - but if she somehow disabled something she shouldn't have..... I just don't know.

Did a system Restore back to Feb. 26 (the day after I got it) everything looked ok, found out it was the Alter Ego config settings that I changed (shaderLevel @ 0, antialiasingLevel @ 0) that caused the text "Compatibility (low-end HW detected)" to show at bottom of game's main menu - anyone know what causes this text to be displayed at these settings?

I'm beginning to suspect that this text has nothing to do with whatever graphics card (HD media card or NVidia card) that the computer is using while gaming thus.

Following my System Restore back to the 26th, the HD Media card has automatically been re-enabled, and I haven't disabled anything since.

EDIT - read in Terri's post that this message may be indicating that my NVidia graphics card may be low-end - either that, or it's default set to use the HD Media chipset card. But the laptop's NVidia card is a GeForce GT 420M DDR3 - this isn't low-end, is it?

According to the folks at notebookcheck.net it's not -

The NVIDIA GeForce GT 420M is a fast mid-range laptop graphics card presented in 2010. It is based on the GF108 core, which is related to the Fermi architecture. Therefore, it supports DirectX 11 and OpenGL 4.0. In contrast to the GT 415M, the card features the full 96 shader cores. Compared to the GT425M and GT435M, the 420M offers lower clock rates.

Edit -

The notebook I'm looking at to replace my HP has an GTS 350M, both are class 2 IGP's (by today's standards).

Found out how to fix the graphic card settings -

I went to Control Panel > NVidia Control Panel > 3D settings > Highlight "manage 3D settings" in left pane, > In "manage 3D Settings" (right pane) go to Program Settings > Select a program to customize > Add > Computer > C:\ > Program Files (x86) > Viva Media (highlight this) > Open > Highlight game > Open > select game's shortcut-like icon > click on this > Open, and it takes you back to the Manage 3D Settings panel, from there where it says "select preferred graphics processor for this program", you have 2 choices - either the Integrated graphics or the high performance NVidia Processor, Highlight "NVidia processor" > Apply.

They really buried it deep, didn't they.

That's Nvidia for you - when I need to change graphics settings for a specific game (if the option is not inside the game options), I have to follow the same path for my GTX 260. It's actually not as bad as it looks and is pretty intuitive.

Comparing my new laptop's graphics card with that of my old HP Compaq Presario X6000 laptop, I found this at Notebookcheck.net -



I'm starting to believe my old laptop's graphics card is a bit slower than the one in my new laptop, but was the one in my old laptop a low-end graphics card?

Quite a bit slower.


Yes it was low end, and strictly speaking it was a chipset built into the motherboard and not a separate card. I don't know if your particular card had discrete VRAM or not, which is another consideration for games.

I've use the NVidia control panel to try to make the game (alter Ego) switch to Nvidia card, and changed the default Intel HD graphics setting to Nvidia GeForce GT 420M in the game's engine file, saved it, but it didn't work - the game strill automatically switches to Intel HD graphics, running in Compatibility graphics mode (low-end HW detected) mode. Nothing I try forces it to switch to the NVidia card, and at one point in the game, half of Tim's body is cut off in the basement at the bar after the fight - I believe this is because the HD card isn't rendering the scene properly which is why I need to force the game to switch to the NVidia card - how do I force the game to switch to NVidia instead of running in compatibility graphics mode?

I've never had a laptop with switchable graphics, so I don't know any tricks to getting it to work. Maybe ask over at the Notebookreview.com forum.

It sounds like you managed to boot back into Windows 7 though, which is good to hear.

Thanks, Jenny. I didn't even know this site existed! I've just registered over there, and posted from this thread there, adding some screenshots of Alter Ego's amonaly. Do I should've went there before picking out my new laptop so that I'd avoid "buyer's regret" (not that I have it, I hope I'm going to be quite happy with my new laptop)?




Yes, I did, Jenny, but now (until I do the MS fix Inland linked to) I have to keep going into the BIOS and switching back and forth from AHCI to IDE each time I want to boot into Win 7 or XP.

That's not too bad. You'll be able to try games with Windows 7 while you're working on getting XP's drivers sorted out.

I found ***this thread*** about switchable graphics in an Acer 5745G. They mention moving the graphics selection in the BIOS from "Switchable" to "Discrete." They say it didn't work for them, but you have a newer model. Have you tried that setting in the BIOS?

I didn't even know about this. I'll give it a try tomorrow - it's bed, dreamtime and beyond here!

Yes, I have the NVidia Optimus technology - is this what you mean by I have a newer model?

I'm in the BIOS of my laptop now, but I don't see any such graphics setting in my BIOS, but there is a setting for the Network Boot: Atheros in the "boot" section of the BIOS. Right now I'm looking at the first category "information" in my BIOS, and all the listings are grayed out (printed in dark gray) and there are entries that says, "system BIOS version: v1.15" and "VGA BIOS version: NVidia VGA 70.08.19.00.04" - both are grayed out.

I'm beginning to think that while the NVidia 420M card shows up in Device Manager under Display Adapters, this may be false (a lie) and my laptop doesn't have a NVidia 3D graphics card, but when I went into the NVidia card's properties (while still in Device Manager), I clicked on the Resources Tab where it lists the Resource Settings, and below the Resource Settings window, in grayed out text it says "setting based on" with a grayed out box next to it, as well as grayed out "use automatic settings (which is already check-boxed)" with a window next to this bearing the text "change setting" inside it.

Anyone know about this and how to make it use the NVidia card rather than the Intel HD graphics card (which it was apparently set to by default)?

cruise, why don't you try posting again over at the notebook forum, but this time post in the Acer forum subject. You posted in the gaming forum subject where they talk about gaming on laptops. But your question is more of a technical question specific to your Acer notebook. Your laptop is supposed to switch to the Nvidia card when the laptop is plugged in or when you press the "P" key. Does it do that when you are not playing a game?

Maybe someone will respond to your question in the Acer forum.

I don't think you have a technical issue, but I sure hope you don't since you have already voided your warranty.

Pressing the P key does not make it switch, nor does it switch when plugged in. It remains stuck on the Intel HD graphics.

I just reposted in the Acer forum over at notebook review, and am waiting for someone to respond. I got no responses at all in the other forum that I posted in - it was like they were ignoring me.

I don't think they were ignoring you, cruise. You just asked the question in a forum where they didn't know the answer.

I hope someone in the Acer forum answers you though.

Cruise....

According to the reviews I've seen on this laptop, your graphics are supposed to automatically switch when plugged in...i.e. the lower end Intel will kick in when running on battery to conserve power, but when plugged in, the Nvidia card kicks in.

If this is not working for you, why don't you visit the Acer website, go to Support and request a live chat with one of their tech reps? They may be able to assist you. The idea of a live chat over the internet may expedite the solution to this issue. I love manufacturers that offer those!

When I first got my Asus laptop, I ran into a few bugs and issues. Visiting their support site, led me to the answers I needed...mostly in the forums....as well as warded me off from trying some things that turned some folks laptops into "bricks."

Here is a link to the Acer Technology Support page... Acer Support

Thanks, Drac.

I tried the Acer Live Chat but that person said my issue was beyond his/her scope. He/she then linked me to an AnswersByUs where I'd have to pay a fee, I hate having to pay a fee just to fix an issue, so I declined after I read the terms/conditions posted by AnswersByUs. This fee is too big for my wallet ($130 and up).

If your issue was strictly switching the Graphics from the Intel to the Nvidia....that's a feature of the basic laptop. You shouldn't have to pay if something isn't working...since you're still under warranty.

You didn't ask about your XP operating install etc did you? The website says that they do not support installation of OS other than what came installed on the laptop.

Did you just ask the basic question about the graphics?

Yes, I asked only about the graphics non-switching - nothing about the XP install at all.

My issue was strictly switching from Intel graphics to NVidia graphics - otherwise everything else works fine.

Then if it isn't working....this should be under warranty support. I would try again with a different tech and keep it simple.

"My switchable graphics is not working. It appears to be stuck in Intel, even when plugged in. Can you assist?

Thanks, JK. I got better results, got a toll free # to call where I have to ask to speak with a level 2 agent about my issue and it's free. Will call tomorrow. But we live in Pittsburgh,Pa. What would 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. central time be in our area?

Central time is one hour earlier, Cruise. So that would be 9 am to 9 pm eastern time.

Just checked my post in the Acer forum at laptopreviews - still no replies. might they be stumped?

Whatever you do, don't say anything about the fact that you have voided your warranty by installing XP. If you have to send it back, you will probably be completely out of luck.

I sure hope they can help you out tomorrow... Good luck and let us know what happens.

Thanks, Drac. Will keep you posted on what happens. Just checked over at notebookreview and saw that I got 1 reply (which I just responded to) after using JKeerie's suggestion of how to ask for help - I think since I was wording my thread topic wrong (by using the same words I used for this thread's topic,) people either got confused or didn't know how to respond, so as a result I didn't get any replies before.

The individual at NotebookReview didn't give you much of an answer, just some blather about the Optimus technology. None of which addressed your question. However, I found this in a review...

THEN I found a white paper on Nvidia's Optimus Technology that says there are some applications that block switchable graphics which do not use Optiums (as in your laptop), such as 3D games. Some limitations of regular switchable graphics:

*Manual Mode Changes – Every time a switch between integrated and discrete graphics mode is desired, the user needs to manually change the setting. If users forget to enable the GPU before launching a game for example, they need to quit the game and enable the GPU before re-launching the application.
*Transition time – Due to the multiplexer and driver load and unload process, there is typically a delay of 5 to 10 seconds or more to switch between integrated graphics and the discrete GPU.
*Blocking Applications – Often applications “block” a mode switch. 3D and video applications and games like Solitaire and Minesweeper would cause a block. Each must be closed before the system will permit switching between the integrated graphics and the GPU. If users forget to close a 3D or video application, they often would not realize the graphics mode did not change back to integrated graphics as expected.
*Screen Flicker – As the system switches between the integrated graphics and discrete GPU, the screen flickers due to the driver load time and multiplexers. This can be an annoyance or cause panic as users might assume there is a problem with the system.

Ok, everyone - the level 2 Acer tech said that my laptop isn't made to use the NVidia GPU, it'll only switch if I plug in a external monitor into my HDMI port, otherwise it'll remain stuck at the Intel HD graphics integrated chipset when I play 3D games on the laptop's attached LCD screen, also my laptop is not able to switch to nvidia when plugged in, so - it looks like I'm going to return the laptop for a full refund and ask here at GB as well as at notebookreviews on what's the best gaming laptop (other than an alienware) to buy for my $$$$.

I've already contacted the ebay seller, stating I'm not happy with my laptop and would like to return it for a full refund.

Drac, CYPM, please.

Well, then, Cruise. It appears to be terribly disingenuous of Acer to market a laptop as having a graphics card that can only be accessed under conditions for which you would normally not use a laptop. If one wanted to be tethered to an external monitor, why not simply purchase a much less expensive desktop.

Now, did you alter the laptop in any way...that is your XP install? If so, the seller may refuse to accept it for a full refund.

I'm going to do some checking. This is NOT the way this laptop is advertised to work. Nor do any of the reviews I've read mention it. Either the eBay seller sold her something that isn't correct, she made a mistake or she was lied to by the level 2 Acer tech.

We told cruise she would be voiding her warranty, but she went ahead anyway. Even removing all the alterations will not help.

You're right, Drac. The original seller's posting indicated the Nvidia Graphics card only...at least I didn't see anything regarding switchable graphics.

Go back and see if you can get a different llevel 2 tech ask the same question.... and state that this is not the way it is advertised... it says it switches when unplugged to save power... it does not say you have to have it connected to a monitor.. the purpose of a laptop is just that lap!

edit..yea ,, but then it should be using the nvidia ???

Neither did I. When I read the specs, I was led to believe this laptop uses the NVidia graphics card right off the bat as soon as it boots into the OS.

They call it switchable graphics, but it's really a technology that optimizes battery life - hence the name Optimus. Your laptop does NOT appear to be operating correctly as far as that dedidated Nvidia graphics card. And it sounds to me like it never did since that was one of the first questions you asked after you got it.

OK, here is a description of cruise02's laptop that I trust from Amazon. I simply don't have a good feeling for these eBay sellers that post specifications in 2 foot tall letters etc. Read the video specs carefully. This particular one DOES use the Optimus technology which is intended to extend battery life by using the lower power integrated graphics when the laptop is not plugged in. When plugged in, it automatically switches to the dedicated Nvidia graphics. Something is VERY stinky in Denmark.

Acer Laptop Specs

Cruise, that level 2 tech lied to you. As JK says, this laptop absolutely does NOT require connection to an exterior monitor to use the dedicated Nvidia graphics.

I'm sure you said you'd checked in the Device Manager to be sure the drivers were up to date for the Nvidia card, right? I just hope when you first said you disabled the integrated video in your first post, that you didn't mess something up with the dedicated card.

This is way beyond my knowledge, so hopefully Jenny or Inland can get this sorted out. But I'm still quite disturbed that this Acer tech would lie like that.

Aww - I believed that tech, and I just contacted the seller stating I want to return it for a refund - what am I supposed to do at this point?

Drac....that same white paper states the following:

NVIDIA Optimus Technology delivers great battery life and great performance, in a way that simply works. It automatically and instantaneously uses the best tool for the job – the high performance NVIDIA GPU for GPU-Compute applications, video, and 3D games; and low power integrated graphics for applications like Office, Web surfing, or email.
The result is long lasting battery life without sacrificing great graphics performance, delivering an experience that is fully automatic and behind the scenes.
When the GPU can provide an increase in performance, functionality, or quality over the IGP for an application, the NVIDIA driver will enable the GPU. When the user launches an application, the NVIDIA driver will recognize whether the application being run can benefit from using the GPU. If the application can benefit from running on the GPU, the GPU is powered up from an idle state and is given all rendering calls.
Using NVIDIA‟s Optimus technology, when the discrete GPU is handling all the rendering duties, the final image output to the display is still handled by the Intel integrated graphics processor (IGP). In effect, the IGP is only being used as a simple display controller, resulting in a seamless, flicker-free experience with no need to reboot.
When less critical or less demanding applications are run, the discrete GPU is powered off and the Intel IGP handles both rendering and display calls to conserve power and provide the highest possible battery life.
The beauty of Optimus is that it leverages

This seems to indicate that the Intel processor handdles the image even though the Nvidia card is working. Are we so certain that it isn't working?

And I do agree with you, Drac. Two inch tall letters just plain scare me!

Try to talk to another Acer tech and tell them that this laptop does NOT require the use of an exterior monitor to enable the dedicated graphics card. The seller probably won't take it back anyway. You are most likely going to be stuck with Acer. And with a voided warranty, I just can't say what will happen. You won't fool them like you think you can.

EDIT: I didn't read that far down in that white paper, JK. Hmmm... maybe cruise's dedicated graphics IS being used, just not like she (or probably me) for that would think that it should work?

Take a peek at a Toshiba 3DV5, I just picked up a 3DV8 (it's bigger brother) but the 3DV5 seems to be fairly comparable to your Acer model.

They're Satellite’s, not laptops - but considering what I paid for it, I'm happy.

At this point I wouldn't want an Acer laptop -- especially not one with switchable graphics. You know the switchable graphics are not working as intended, so there may be a hardware problem. And then either Acer tech support lied to you or the laptop is not as it was advertised.


I was wondering that myself. It seems to be what the guy at ***Notebookreview*** meant by

But if missing parts of people is what the Nvidia is going to produce, and driver choice is limited by the integration with the Intel, this laptop doesn't seem like a good choice for gaming.

Inland and Jenny, what do you think of the discussion of how cruise's graphics is working or not working, as the case may be? Could it be what this white paper I found says, that the integrated graphics is still handling the imaging even thought the dedicadated graphics card is being used? Could it be that her graphics are working just fine? It uses this Nvidia Optiums technology that indicates it is more of a coordination between the integrated and dedicated graphics.

I'm totally confused and this tech and her lying has made things even worse.

Editing while you're editing: That would explain what that guy said. I'm also wondering now if cruise tried turning down some of the graphics options in the game that would help?

You posted as I was adding to my post.
I don't think it's working "just fine" because the graphics are not rendering characters properly. But it may be working. Of course Cruise02 did say...

So if it were using the Nvidia, why would it give a message about using low-end graphics?


It's hard to believe a tech would say you had to attach the laptop to a monitor in order to use the 3D graphics. Who would want to buy the laptop if that was the case?


I don't know if the game has graphics options, but Cruise02 could check. Even if it worked, it wouldn't solve the problem of the game not using Nvidia graphics for 3D applications like games when it should (assuming it's still giving the message about "using HD video (low-end graphics)".

I don't think any of us anticipated this problem with switchable graphics.


Is that a laptop with a 3D screen, Inland?

Thanks, Jenny. Could all this confusion be because of cruise's "successful fix" which got the characters to show up? Could it have kicked in the HD graphics? She said this HD message showed up after she did this "fix." I wonder what would happen if she returned these levels back to default. I'm probably showing my lack of knowledge here!! From Cruise's post (which may have gone unnoticed as it was in a 7 month old thread)...

There's no graphics options in Alter Ego's menu. Again, since I already contacted the seller stating I want to return it for a full refund (and considering the fact that I voided the warranty but did not tell the seller this) what should I do now?

I already told Mom about returning the laptop and getting another one, and she told me "that's why she doesn't like to buy computers off the internet, b/c if something goes wrong with it, you can't take it back, whereas if you buy it from a local store, if there's a problem with the computer, we can take it back to the store to return it for a full refund/exchange it/get it fixed, and Mom said she doesn't like to buy computers made in Japan/Tiwan, she'd rather buy an American-made gaming laptop, but when I checked the websites of Office Max/Office Depot for gaming laptops, I only get listings for laptop stands/accessories and the laptops on best buy's website only have Intel HD graphics, the only gaming laptops Best Buy has to offer are the expensive Alienware models.

So what can I do now?

Have you tried any other games to see if you get any messages like the one you saw after you edited the Alter Ego file?

Although I don't like the way this Nvidis Optimus Technology works, I'm not convinced it's not working as it's supposed to. This may have been something with that one game. And if it's all working like it's supposed to, you still might have a very good laptop. It's rated very, very highly everywhere I read reviews.

Tell mom, there is no such thing as a laptop made in the US. And if you bought one from a store, you would still be dealing with the manufacturer. Everyone I know who has had to take a laptop in for repair under warranty to Best Buy had the laptop sent back to the manufacturer.

And if you end up having to keep this one, I would highly recommend getting rid of your partition and trying to install XP on a computer which was never meant to run it. Get a nice cheap laptop and partition and play away on it until you get so good at it you can do it in your sleep! Unless you are really good at this and have anticipated all the potential problems, a brand new $700+ laptop is not the best place to practice and experiment.

Just changed Alter Ego's shader level/antialiasing levels to 2 and 4 (the default values respectivcely), started up the game and did not see that "compatibiulity mode (low-end HW detected)" text at the bottom of the game's menu, but when I opened up a save, the characters were visible, after this, going back to the game's menu there was that "compaytibility mode (low-end HW detected)" text back again at the bottom of the game's menu.

(text from game's engine file after shader = 2, antiliasing = 4:)

AGDS5 Engine 1.9.4.9
-----------------------------
SystemCPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i3 CPU M 370 @ 2.40GHz
SystemOS: Windows Vista 32bit
SystemGPU: NVIDIA Corporation GeForce GT 420M/PCI/SSE2
SystemSPU: Speakers (Realtek High Definiti
SystemMemory: 3766.676 MB
SystemRender: OpenGL 4.0.0
ShaderModel: 4.0
MouseButtons: 5
MouseWheel: 1
Monitors: 1
Monitor Resolution: 1366 x 768
-----------------------------
CoreRender: Initilaized 1366 x 768

Edit - changed shader level = 0, antialiasing level = 0, tested gtame, went back into game, loaded a save, exited, checked game's engine, Nvidia GPU still showing up here, yet that "Comp....(low-end HW detected)" text showing up on game's menu.




Ok - where can I get one? What will Mom say if I tell her this? Could this be a gaming laptop? How much should I pay for it? After all, she's not computer literate, she just does email, solitaire and word perfect on her desktop PC (which is IIRC over 5 years old.)

First, what exactly is "low end HW"?

There are some US companies that custom build laptops, but you'll pay a lot more for them.


She's already created the partition, and apparently managed to get XP on it without harming Windows 7. Any drivers she installs over on the XP partition won't harm Windows 7. So unless she's absolutely given up on XP for this laptop, I'd recommend leaving the partitioning alone. That said, the switchable graphics may present a problem in XP since the Nvidia apparently only works in tandem with the Intel and not on its own.


Are the characters showing up OK now? Is anything wrong besides getting that message? Have you tried any other games that are showing the same problem?

I believe this refers to the Intel HD graphics chipset in my new Acer laptop. And Drac, I forgot to ask you, if I get myself a nice cheap laptop to experiment on, can I still keep both my Asus netbook and my Acer laptop (now I'm starting to hope I can keep it after all) that I just bought?

And where is the message coming from? From the game? As video cards go, the 420M could be considered low end, though the Intel graphics is lower.

Yes, it is -

Gee, I've no clue where this message is coming from. I believe it is originating from the computer being stuck at Intel HD graphics.


Yes, the characters showed up ever since I changed the shader/antilaising values to 0, and I posted the fix in that 7-month-old thread.
No, I have not yet tried playing any other games to see if that message appears.

EDIT - normally, I wouldn't be concerned about that message, but in the latest scenes part of my character's (Tim) body is cut off - this led me to believe Alter Ego was running off of the Intel HD chipset rather than the NVidia card b/c these scenes wern't being rendered fully.

If it's coming from the game, you probably wouldn't see it in other games.


Try a variety of other games -- especially later ones that would need more from the graphics card.


Yes, but we were assuming that by "low-end graphics hardware" it meant the Intel and not the Nvidia. The game may be throwing up that message every time it switches between the Intel and the Nvidia 420M. The game may consider both "low-end." The Nvidia 420M may be adequate for adventure games, but it's not a high-end or medium-end card. Do a Google search and you'll see it's considered low-end.

There might be something about the way characters are rendered in that particular part of the game that causes them to be cut off. You may be using the 420M at the time you're seeing those cut-off characters.

How do you like the 3D effects on your 3DV8?

Very cool - I'm sure the feeling will wear off, but for now it's kind of a neat toy.

To Drac - Regarding getting myself a good cheap laptop to experiment on - I just told Mom that if my Penna. sister/her husband/son is getting rid of any of their laptops, I'd take it, to which Mom agreed.

Now, several hours ago I contacted the ebay seller telling him that I wasn't satisfied with my laptop, that I wanted to return it for a full refund, but now that I've had this thorough discussion with you guys, I'm thinking that I'd rather hold on to my new Acer laptop - so what do I do at this point? You guys never got back to me about this.

I don't think we've determined whether the laptop is going to render your games satisfactorily yet in Windows 7. Suppose Alter Ego isn't the only game where people have pieces missing? We have to make sure it's going to work out as a gaming laptop for you, even if only in Windows 7. Unlike having a straight Nvidia card, where you could download a variety of drivers from laptopvideo2go, you apparently need drivers that work with the Intel/Nvidia combo, and there are far fewer drivers available for that.

Just got another reply at notebookreviews.com -



What do you think of this, people?

EDIT - when I ordered this Acer from ebay, I thought I was getting a laptop with a straight NVidia 3D card - which is what I'm really after, not some "combo NVidia/HD graphics".

So if I do get to keep this Acer laptop, I reckon I can sell it to my Penna. sister's family (and perhaps get their used laptop in addition to the money)?

What do I tell the seller at this point?

I think Meaker probably knows what he's talking about when he says you can't turn off the switchable part. As for getting a laptop with a separate video card, you wouldn't get an actual video card in a 15" laptop at your price point. You get a chipset that's integrated into the motherboard and (hopefully) has dedicated graphics memory. The only laptops I know of that have separate video cards are large and thick and heavy and expensive. And you don't really need a separate card for adventure games.

See if the seller is willing to take it back. It doesn't sound like you're satisfied with it.

I still think you should try more games with it, but I have a feeling it's never going to suit you. The question is whether you'll find anything better for games at your price point.

Exactly what kind of graphics card do I really need for adventure games that'll suit me into the next 3 to 5 years from now?



Have contacted seller - waiting for him to get back to me. Should I tell him I messed with the partitions and voided the warranty regarding returning the laptop for a full refund?



Well, I want a nice adventure gaming laptop (as opposed to FPS/RPG/action gaming laptop), but want to steer away from these with a combo discrete video card/integrated HD graphics, so could you give me some specs recommendations at my price point and I'll post this at notebookreviews.com when I ask over there after I get my money back, ok?

Cruise...It's a matter of honesty. If you don't admit to the partitions and I was the next poor schmuck to purchase this same laptop from this seller (who will most certainly sell it to someone else)...I would be pretty upset.

My two year old Asus Vista (that I took a couple of months to think about) has played everything so far with the exception of the old Thief games.It does have a separate video card, the Nvidia 9800 (laptop version of course). Yes it is heavier and thicker and tends to run a bit hotter than say my grandsons HP entertainment laptop. It has different modes to cope with this, battery saving, quiet office, entertainment and high performance. I usually just leave it on the latter since I have a cooler and leave it plugged in most of the time.

We have a tech over here that builds laptops to order besides desktops (not cheap though)and has only 4 that he says is for gaming. At least on their website, though I know he can make just about anything for a price. Not that you would ever buy from Hawaii, but take a look at the specs.
Falcon Hawaii

I wish you luck cruise, hope you get everything sorted out and do as Jenny says, try more games.

I just checked out that page, Hawka, but I don't know which ones are the gaming laptops - and why wouldn't I buy a customized laptop from Hawaii? This is, after all, part of the United States.

So is it possible for you to point out these 4 gaming laptops, Hawka, so I can play with the configs and check out this tech's prices?



So JK, should I contact the seller again (immediately) and admit to what I did with the partitions?

Better than a 420M apparently.


Have you checked whether you actually voided the warranty? Did the warranty forbid any software changes? Repartitioning doesn't "break" the hard drive any more than loading games on it. It's not a hardware change. It doesn't involve taking a screwdriver to the laptop and pulling its insides out.

If you're returning it to the seller, he'd have to expect you'd used the laptop and it isn't new anymore. If he resold it, he'd sell it as used. I suspect he's not going to give you a full refund on it, though he might give you a partial refund.


Have you tried other games with the laptop you have? I've only played adventure games using desktop video cards. Inland could give you a better idea since he's used laptops for gaming.

Just hold on. cruise02... wait to see what he says..you can always say you changed your mind.. start more games and see if you have problems and then take it from there...

Looking at some reviews... I would think this would be ok for adventure games if it can run these..?
Pros:
Gaming Graphics- the NVIDIA discrete graphics card e I play COD:Black Ops, Crysis Warhead and the new NFS incarnation, all in high settings. The great NVIDIA Optimus feature also turns off the discrete card and turns on the built in Intel Graphics for less intensive applications and games like NFS: Most Wanted, a great feature to conserve on battery life. PhysX is also great for compatible games like Batman: Arkham Asylum.

I just sent the seller another email admitting to the changes I made to the partitions, installing XP, and asked if he would still be willing to accept the laptop for a refund. So far, he still hasn't gotten back to me.

I don't know how to check to see if I had actually voided the warranty - how do I check?

1. Locate the warranty.
2. Read the warranty.

Is the warranty in a file on your computer?

I've not a clue as to where the warranty is.



Winfrey - which laptop is this review for?



Ok, Winfrey - will do like you told me to do. After I made this latest post here, I gave Baron Wittard Nemesis of Ragnarok about an hour's or so playthrough (on Win 7 64-bit), and I have no problems, that Compatibility graphics...(low-end HW detected) message did not appear at all when Baron Wittard and Black Mirror 2 were running. Tomorrow I'll print out a partial Black Mirror 2 w/t and give the game a playthrough, then I'll install Nikopol, Immortals of Terra, Rhem 4, and give these a playthrough.

EDIT - I noticed while playing Baron Wittard I felt quite happy and satisfied with how everything was (concerning the laptop) going.

Told Mom that laptops that have a separate 3D card in them are heavier, bigger, and thicker, to which Mom added "and they're more expensive." So will I need such a laptop to see me through the next 3 - 5 years if I stick to adventure gaming playing the latest releases?

I can't find anything about a warranty that's specific to Acer.
According to ***Notebookreview's Warranty Guide*** you don't have anything to worry about:

However the warranty will not cover you getting your money back because the Optimus graphics aren't working properly with a particular game. It's not a "satisfied or your money back" guarantee.

If you still have the link from your auction, you can check if the seller has any kind of guarantee.

Yes, I still have the link from the auction on my Macbook Pro.

But read this - now I'm not sure if I still want to return the Acer laptop, or keep it -



Winfrey - which laptop is this review for?



Ok, Winfrey - will do like you told me to do. After I made this latest post here, I gave Baron Wittard Nemesis of Ragnarok about an hour's or so playthrough (on Win 7 64-bit), and I have no problems, that Compatibility graphics...(low-end HW detected) message did not appear at all when Baron Wittard and Black Mirror 2 were running. Tomorrow I'll print out a partial Black Mirror 2 w/t and give the game a playthrough, then I'll install Nikopol, Immortals of Terra, Rhem 4, and give these a playthrough.

EDIT - I noticed while playing Baron Wittard I felt quite happy and satisfied with how everything was (concerning the laptop) going.

Told Mom that laptops that have a separate 3D card in them are heavier, bigger, and thicker, to which Mom added "and they're more expensive." So will I need such a laptop to see me through the next 3 - 5 years if I stick to adventure gaming playing the latest releases?

Or should I keep this Acer laptop I bought from ebay and maybe in 5 years I'll have my computer tech job, so I'll be able to afford a newer laptop that has a separate 3D card and by that time these kind of laptops might be made smaller (more compact) and lighter in weight (b/c of more advanced computer technology that doesn't even exist at this time)?

Speaking of more advance computer technology, I recall 5 years ago when I still had my old laptop (March 2006) I was thinking of upgrading its 40 GB hard drive with a 500 GB hard drive, and my nephews tried to explain to me that putting a 500 GB hard drive into a laptop just wasn't possible, but I hung onto the idea, with the result I now have 2 laptops with a 500 GB hard drive - my MacBook Pro, and that Acer laptop I got off of ebay.

Will you need an expensive gaming computer with a discrete video card to play current adventure games?

No. Several people on this forum have done very well with mid-range laptop "cards" which are actually chipsets built into the motherboard.

Will you need an expensive gaming computer with a discrete video card to play games 3 to 5 years in the future?

A laptop with what is now considered a low-end video "card" is likely to struggle with adventure games in 3 to 5 years, where a laptop with what is now considered a high-end video card might not (assuming the laptop was still functional). But such high-end laptops are likely to be more than twice your budget, and the life span of a laptop is generally far less than that of a desktop.


I think you'll end up keeping this laptop because you can't return it. If you really want a gaming computer, you're better off building a desktop yourself. This laptop should play most current adventure games, though you may have graphics problems with some games the way you did with Alter Ego. As far as I can tell from what you've written, Alter Ego is still playable.

As of now, I believe I'm going to keep the Acer laptop, after all. I guess all of us boomers here just had to air everything out, and yes, Alter Ego is playable. I haven't touched that XP partition in the Acer laptop, but as soon as I get this issue of the XP NVidia driver not recognizing my laptop's NVidia card (on the XP side) solved I'm going to test Alter Ego on XP and report back to you guys, ok?

I found ***this Youtube video*** that compares Optimus technology with switchable graphics.
I think I'd rather have the switchable graphics.
I also found ***this article about Optimus*** which tells a bit more about it.

Cruise02, I just put that in there to give you an idea about how much a custom computer would cost you. I don't know much about them myself as I am not looking to buy one. The links to the gaming ones are on the left hand side under features if you want to look. It wouldn't be feasible for you to buy one here on this island, they are warranted by the owner for one year, he builds them, he fixes them, they don't go anywhere and are usually in and out in one day, a plus. The other Falcon place is in the northwest, http://www.falcon-nw.com/ they have some beauties and if I had money to burn, wow!!!

Since you already bought this Acer I think you should use it and not fret about how many years it will last you, and how many years it can still play games. In your case since you have so many others to use, it will probably "live" for a long time, but the games will fly on past it's capabilities, that is a given.

Well, then I hope the games won't fly past my Acer's capabilities until at least 5 years from now, by then hopefully I'll be working as a computer tech and will have the money to spend on a better, more capabile laptop. Also, Hawka, at the bottom of that Optimus article it says that currently, the Optimus drivers do not yet recognize all games that are thrown at it, so I suspect that that's why Alter Ego is running in low-end HW mode, as the driver doesn't recognize this particular game?

About that Falcon site, Hawka, these custom-build (this is one of the things I hope to do for when I have my computer tech job) laptops cost over $1,000 - too much for me to pay at this time.

EDIT - So far the seller hadn't gotten back to me but I just sent him a new email stating I've changed my mind about returning the laptop (after discussing it with you buddies here at GB) and that I wanted to keep the laptop, and that if I returned it I'd likely regret that decision later.

The reviews were for the 5745g.... I followed Drac's link took me to Amazon... click on the 23 reviews..... they like the video card.... link to Amazon

Winfrey, that's what I was reading earlier in the reviews of this laptop too. People were running all their high-demand games in full settings and this laptop could handle it beautifully. As I said, this laptop got very, very good reviews.

I noticed that when I was reading all these reviews on it, Drac and Winfrey. I'm now glad that the seller never got back to me on returning it before I sent him a third email, and in the latest email to the seller (sent earlier this morning around 7 a.m.) I told the seller I changed my mind about wanting to return it, that if I did return it I might regret it, and that I wanted to keep the laptop after all.

You're not going to get the XP/Optimus issue solved anytime soon -

Nvidia Optimus Review

Quote: At the moment, Optimus only works under Windows 7 with Nvidia graphic cards manufactured in 40 nm (most of the latest GeForce 200M and 300 graphic cards.

From the technical documents I've read for Optimus, the secondary IGP is basically a bridge used to offload video processing from the Intel processor. It does this by rendering the image and updating the primary IGP's frame buffer directly. So, the only thing your LCD ever really sees is the Intel processor.

The images you posted look more like texture clipping to me. Unfortunately, I don't have the game installed anymore, so I don't recall which in-game options were available that might affect it. I'll load it up later today and take a peak.

To make the whole thing even more complicated, the rules for utilizing the nVidia processor are controlled by software and aren't documented anywhere that I could find. If you're still using the driver's profile to force the use of the nVidia processor, and it's not working, it sounds like the technology is a bit flawed.

Alter Ego wasn't an overly demanding game video wise, have you tried removing the profile and just letting the PC do its thing?

No, never thought of this - how do I remove the profile? Where is it?

You pointed to it here -

Found out how to fix the graphic card settings -

I went to Control Panel > NVidia Control Panel > 3D settings > Highlight "manage 3D settings" in left pane, > In "manage 3D Settings" (right pane) go to Program Settings > Select a program to customize > Add > Computer > C:\ > Program Files (x86) > Viva Media (highlight this) > Open > Highlight game > Open > select game's shortcut-like icon > click on this > Open, and it takes you back to the Manage 3D Settings panel, from there where it says "select preferred graphics processor for this program", you have 2 choices - either the Integrated graphics or the high performance NVidia Processor, Highlight "NVidia processor" > Apply.

And then there's this:

I don't think the laptop will be able to detect the Nvidia chipset when you try to install the drivers if all the display connections go to the Intel. It seems like the Nvidia chip is just piggybacking on top of the Intel. The Nvidia has to work along with the Intel or not at all.

Yeah - I was curious just how nVidia was distributing their drivers for these configurations.

It turns out that they have Optimus specific drivers - you can't just download traditional driver updates for these laptops. And... in as much as they're only supported under Windows 7, XP will always be an issue.

All replies have been beamed aboard the spaceship and stored in the ship's computer awaiting printout by the ship's librarian who will assemble said printouts in book form for Captain Ag to refer to when troubleshooting any graphics card-intensive computers on his away missions to far-flung planets.

By the way, Captain Ag may be receiving another laptop computer (from a group of beings on a distant world) having requested this of The Most High King of the Universe in his cabin aboard the space cruiser, The Tami Rae.

From previous experience I think this translates to enough information for now.

**Latest update**

Mom told me my Penna. sister's family likely won't be buying new laptops for the next couple of years from now, thus at this time they're not getting rid of their old ones, but while at my Bible study teacher's house this afternoon I asked my Bible study teacher to ask around among her friends/relatives if anyone wants to get rid of a nice laptop that I'd be glad to take off of their hands that I'd be able to put XP on as well as have no difficulty in getting all the XP drivers for the hardware (which InlandAZ said doesn't exist for my Acer laptop's hardware) so I'd hopefully be able to play some of my XP games on, as well as tinker with VirtualBox, etc, and take with me on the bus to Barnes & Noble, Panara Bread, and my sister's house during holiday family gatherings (in addition to my Acer Win 7 laptop, although I'll take either the Win 7 laptop or the Win XP laptop with me at any one time, not both) and game on.

I'll be using this XP laptop for these games that won't run on Win 7 (at least, for me).

**latest update 2**

Since I found InlandAZ was right about not being able to find XP drivers for my Acer laptop's hardware, I think I'm going to delete the XP partition, restore the Win 7 partition back to orig. size, and create a Win XP mode using this how-to here -


Creating XP mode in Win 7 Home versions/Vista OS's


and try my non-win 7 running games (and a few other programs) in XP mode.

Also the ebay seller got back to me and said he's glad everything worked out for me (regarding changing my mind about returning the laptop and wanting to keep it).

That's simply using VMWare, isn't it?

And could you remember to let me know if you run into any games which will not play on Windows 7 that are not already listed in the Windows 7 and Gaming thread?

Since Jenny100 said XP mode doesn't make use of 3D graphics, I abandoned this idea, googled for using 1GB VRAM NVidia in VMWare Player, and I was lead to VMWare Player 3.0/3.1, which I believe I had for some time stored on my jump drive, so I deleted the Win XP partition, restored the shrunken Win 7 partition back to original size, installed my VMware Player 3.0 onto my Win 7 laptop, created a new VM using VMware Player 3, which I installed XP onto, installed 80 Days, AnaCarpi, Jazz & Faust, PR: Immortals of Terra on, and tested these. Of these, only 80 Days and AnaCapri run with no problems, but Jazz & Faust crashed after the intro sequence, and PR: Immortals of Terra won't even run.

When I first got my new Acer laptop, I installed PR: Immortals of Terra on it (in Win 7) but it wouldn't even start up/crashed. How do I tweak this game to run in Win 7? I have the 64-bit Win 7 in Acer laptop.

And what tweaks can I use to get Jazz & Faust running in either my laptop's Win 7 or my VMware Player's Win XP VM (it's not XP mode)?

There were patches for Jazz & Faust -

Jazz and Faust patch 2 (Windows)

Because it wasn't designed for Windows 7, try running it in compatibility mode for XP.

No, it's not XP mode -

If you don't know how to use compatibility mode in Windows 7, this is how. (It is NOT the same as XP mode, as Inland says.)

Right click on the game icon, select Troubleshoot compatibility and follow the prompts. I have had to use Windows 98 in some, but I would let the troubleshooter select at first and see what happens.

Inland, the link you gave me took me to Zdnet and they made me register to d/l the patch, then and it wasn't a d/l at all, but another link to Cnet where I tried again to d/l (after doing a search of Cnet) then I found the d/l link, clicked on it, and it made me wait a long time for the d/l to begin, but my d/l never started - nothing I do will start the d/l.

You're right - it doesn't work. I already have an account at ZDNet, so I tried it too.

Try the one from FilePlanet. You don't have to register, but you can if you want.

Jazz and Faust Patch 2 FilePlanet

Unfortunately there are many references that lead to --- broken links...

Goggle the name of the game+patch. You'll eventually find one like Drac's.

As we've said many times before, Google is your friend. That's all I did.

It's next to impossible for me to d/l this patch, I either have to sign up now everywhere (is this the new internet d/l policy?) to d/l, and as soon as I click the d/l link at cnet, it jumps to an advertisement (which I click on "skip") then immediately jumps to a full page of other advertisements - my d/l never starts.

How am I ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever going to be able to d/l this patch?

Pretty soon, all the game patch d/l sites will make you have to sign up to d/l, after this you'll have to start paying fees - I hate this greedy world!!

cruise02 I could not get cnet nor fileplanet to download for me either... I am looking for an alternative
edit
found one at MM go here:

http://mysterymanor.net/Atticsaves/index.php?act=view&id=51

Yep, it looks like all of the links lead to dead ends (just like some adventure games:) )

Thanks, Winfrey! I tried your link and I was able to d/l!

This J&F v2 patch d/l frustration was on the back of my mind while I kept trying to get on the internet on the newly-installed Win XP partition (NOT the VMWare XP VM - this is installed on the now-shrunken Win 7 partition) that I've just created on my new Acer laptop, my laptop has Fn + F3 to turn on the wireless wifi connection (in Win 7) but I tried pressing Fn + F3 on the XP side, but no "on/off" box shows up onscreen - and I have no "internet connection/wireless connection" icon at all on the bottom right side of the Win XP taskbar, so there is no way for me to enable my built-in wifi/wireless internet card on my new laptop (on the new XP partition that I created this afternoon) that I want to use in an attempt to install Driver Detective (or Driver Guide, etc) on to make it scan my system (on the XP side, again NOT the VMware XP VM), find & d/l XP device drivers (tinkering, tinkering, testing, testing, 1, 2, 3...) - how do I fix this problem and get on the internet from XP?

Also I have no wireless internet connection icon in my control panel\network connections, etc - how do I put one there?

The function keys are enabled via software - so, unless Acer supports XP as an OS it's not likely.

Inland, I just checked on Acer's website and I found an Acer Aspire 8935G, this even has a NVidia 3D card - had I'd know about this one (it supports XP x32, Win 7 and Vista) I wouldn't have bought my 5745G, and b/c of this I'm fast getting "buyer's regret" - here, I found what I really want on the acer website.

Acer Aspire 8935G w/ NVidia 3D card

So what do I do now? Email Acer and ask if I could do a trade-in (serious)?

EDIT - My link doesn't take you directly to the Aspire 8935G - you'll have to click on "notebook" > aspire > 8935G to get to the computer/drivers.

And 3 weeks ago I was going blindly upon Drac's advice in picking out a gaming laptop to buy, I tried doing my homework a bit before I posted here in the thread "should I buy this laptop?"

I didn't know I was going to run into this "my acer aspire 5745G doesn't support XP x32" issue when I told Nate to find that laptop that Drac picked out on newegg.

So lately I'm having a lot of aggravation just because maybe I bought the wrong laptop (Acer Aspire) model - instead of a 5745G I now believe I should have bought a 8935G w/ a NVidia graphics card.

But why when I enter the aspire 8935G model in the search bars at both Amazon and ebay, why don't I find listings for the whole computer, but parts for the 8935G instead such as RAM sticks, keyboard, screen, etc?

Here's an Aspire 8935G with a special edition graphics card (changeable) - it's an ATI Radeon, but I wanted an 8935G that is 15-incher, and with a NVidia card (changeable special edition) if possible

Acer Aspire 8935G

EDIT 2 - found another aspire model at acer that supports XP/vista/win7 - a 7738G.

Because it's not available any more.


That price is in Euros. I doubt that "DoneDeal" company would ship to the US, and if you convert Price: €1,150 to US dollars you get a lot higher price than your budget.


Same problem with that one -- hard to find. It's also "a massive 17.3 incher" according to ***this review*** at Notebookcheck.

Ok, maybe I should abandon the Acer brand altogether and look for another brand-name, model that fits these specs -

**15-incher,
**512 MB (or above) VRAM NVidia graphics card,
**it manufacturer supports XP (32-bit)/Win 7 so I'd have no aggravation finding XP as well as Win 7 device drivers,

as for the hard drive/system RAM, I can upgrade these to 500 GB HDD/4 GB RAM later.

that fits my budget - but I might have to sell the Acer (but only if I really have to) to get the $700 back - but if you guys can find me a laptop that fits these specs (marked by a **) please post.

I could partition the new (not the Acer) laptop's HDD (after upgrading it to 500 GB) for Win XP and Win 7.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

EDIT 2 - On the other hand, if it is possible to increase the VRAM for the 3D accelerator in my Win XP VMware Player's VM up to 512 MB, or even 1 GB VRAM and get on the internet (to activate certain games) through VMWare Player, then I'm all in favor of keeping my new Acer laptop - but how exactly do I do these?

Maybe you should ask over at the Notebookreview website. They have a "What notebook should I buy" forum.

You could also look for an older model that originally came with XP on eBay. But avoid any with the Nvidia 8400 or 8600 Go. Some Nvidia 7000 series were also affected. The graphics chip in those had a tendency to go bad and there was a lawsuit about it. There's a list of affected models here
http://www.nvidiasettlement.com/affectedmodels.html

There's an article that describes what caused the problem ***here***.


The problem isn't the VRAM so much as that the emulated video card in VMware isn't a Radeon or Geforce and doesn't use the same drivers as those cards. Games are most often tested with Nvidia or Radeon cards.

cruise, let's get this straight... when I posted that link, it was a suggestion, nothing more. And it was a suggestion based on your first post in which said you wanted a new computer which would play new adventure games. There was no mention of wanting to partition the drive and install XP on it. That all came later. You specifically asked for links to other computers....

I think Jenny's advice above is good - especially asking over at Notebookreview. Just be sure to be clear about EXACTLY what it is you are wanting to do. They are really helpful there.

Drac's answer to your question: "Should I buy it? I'm Latest Game Playing-starved.

Ouote from Drac: "I certainly can't tell you what to buy - all we're doing is linking you to options since that's what you asked for."

Oops, my mistake, Drac. I'm such an idiot, I'm a complete fool! As of now, I emailed the ebay seller of that Acer laptop I bought, told him that the laptop just isn't working out for me as I'd hoped, that I wanted to return it for a refund, and admitted to trying to set it up as a dual boot with XP/win 7 but this did not work out for me.

And, yes, I made a thread at notebookreview about wanting to buy a refurbished laptop with XP on it late last night telling them if I can get it for $100 - $200, I can buy immediately, was directed to ebay/craig's list, so I checked on Craig's list (I thought Mom said that I can have 2 gaming laptops - this Win 7 Acer and a used XP laptop, but this was a misunderstanding between Mom and I. Mom thought I wanted a used laptop to fix for my computer tech hands-on training which she had agreed to, but for me to have 2 gaming laptops is out of the question, and she said I'd have to return the Acer if I wanted another gaming laptop for which I can successfully set up as a dual boot with Win XP/Win 7), found a Dell latitude D600 for $160, but I never contacted that seller but I was thinking about calling them up, but then Mom told me if I wanted another gaming laptop I'd have to return the Acer, next, I contacted the seller of the Acer and am waiting for him to get back to me.

After the seller gets back to me, if he agrees to let me return the Acer, then I'll go back on notebookreview and edit my thread about which laptop to buy, and this time, I'm going to lay out all my cards (as they say in Poker) concerning exactly what I want to do with this next laptop, which I will changed the "refurbished" request to "new".

Otherwise, if the seller will not let me return the Acer, Mom told me I'd have to sell it for half price.

I made a big mistake in buying this Acer. I assumed that XP drivers were going to be readily available at the manufacturer's website, and that my games will make use of its NVidia card without this Optimus technology - which frankly, I don't really care for.

Hi cruise, I'm no techie but browse this forum to pick up 'bare bones' info so I've been following this thread & your other with interest. You didn't state that you wanted a new laptop that you could partition to run two OS otherwise you may have got different advice. It does seem that you are blaming Draclvr for buying the wrong one but who couldn't have given you better advice based on what you had posted. Maybe you don't realise how it comes across, but it seems ungrateful when you are at fault & Draclev has posted so much to help you.

You are not going to get what is considered a "gaming laptop" for $100 - $200 unless it has some defect, like a failing graphics card. What you might find is a laptop that you can set up with XP, possibly experiment with dual booting, and which will play some older games.


A Dell D600 is far from being a "gaming laptop." You can see its system specs ***here***. According to that, it has ATI Radeon 9000 graphics, 4X AGP, with 32 MB of VRAM. Would you be able to play any adventure games on this? Yes -- some of the older ones. Does that make it a "gaming laptop?" Not by any stretch of the imagination. Not even when it was new. A "gaming laptop" is one that plays the latest action/RPG games, or at least did so when the laptop was new. You can play games on a laptop that is not a "gaming laptop." But considering that the D600 only has 32 MB of VRAM and has a very low end graphics card (absolute bottom of ATI's Radeon 9000 series), you won't be able to get many new games to work on it. It would be fine for experimenting with dual booting and other repartitioning experiments though.



How many newer games (as in the last 3 years or so) is this Acer not able to play? I do not think you're going to get something in your price range that does everything you want it to.


Never assume anything. Always check out everything that's important to you before you spend your money. I think this Optimus technology is new to everyone here and we didn't realize the constraints it would have on loading Nvidia drivers. But even without that, there are chipset/motherboard drivers and network/wireless drivers to consider. I once set up an older computer and installed the video drivers, but still couldn't get the video card working properly until I installed the chipset/motherboard drivers. Chipset/motherboard drivers can be very important, not just for video but for USB, network, and other things as well.

Jenny has put things into a nutshell for you with the best advice in the world - never assume ANYTHING. And that's especially true with computers. And this is a recurring theme with you, cruise. You want a computer which will do everything in the world for you except cook breakfast. I've told you on another forum it simply doesn't exist.

I'm still trying to figure out what's wrong with having your very nice Asus EEE Netbook which will play all your XP games and having a great Windows 7 gaming laptop for new games... I don't understand why this isn't good enough for you. Or have you gotten rid of your 160 GB Netbook with XP on it? I would be in heaven with your assortment of computers.

I thought I was going to be happy with the Acer, and I'm sorry (I'm at fault, not Drac, she couldn't read my mind, I should have said it right off the bat that I wanted to set the new laptop up as a dual boot with XP/win 7) for blaming Drac, I'm sorry I didn't explain exactly what my intentions were with the new laptop that I wanted, but what I really, truly wanted was a (not necessarily a gaming laptop) laptop that has NVidia 3D graphics that I'd be able to set up as a dual boot with Windows XP (32-bit)/Win 7 that isn't too old, a 15-incher.

As for my trusty netbook, sure, I'm happy with it, XP and all, but since I want to return the Acer and get another laptop that will work out for me dual-boot-wise, the netbook does not have NVidia 3D graphics, so that said, I want to keep my netbook with its 160 GB hard drive (nice and big!) and just use it for playing DVD movies and doing multiple screenshot captures from these movies and transfer all my game-playing (latest games to DOS games) onto the other laptop I would like to get after I hopefully return the Acer.

Exactly!!

Have you checked whether such a thing exists and whether you can afford it if it does? As I mentioned before, not all that long ago there was a big problem with Nvidia graphics in laptops developing bad VRAM.

If you do decide to get a laptop simply for partitioning practice, the D600 has a disadvantage (though it could be considered an advantage for ease of installation). The D600 is old enough that it won't require SATA/AHCI drivers in order to install XP. However that means you wouldn't get the experience of installing XP on a computer that requires SATA/AHCI drivers to be added during the installation.

Had my eye on this for the past couple of weeks - a Sony Vaio w/ Intel Core Duo CPU 2 GHz, T2500, data bus spd @ 667MHz, NVidia GeForce Go 7600 GT @ 256 MB VRAM GDDR3 SDRAM vid card, only as a 15-inch version and possibly with 512 MB VRAM on the nvidia card. This isn't one of the laptops with the defective NVidia card, is it?

Is it old enough that it doesn't require AHCI drivers, and if I get this, will I be able to set it up as a dual boot with XP (32-bit)/Win 7 and be able to get all the XP device drivers for it?

EDIT - found this on the local Craig's list -
Asus gaming laptop

How do I check whether this model's hardware will support XP (32-bit) for dual booting?

cruise, you do realize an older laptop may not be able to run Windows 7 and that you would have to pay close to $200 for a legal copy of Windows 7 if you got an XP computer that would??

Go to the ASUS website as Jenny did to see if it supports XP drivers. Google is your friend.

Will you be waiting until you find out if the seller will take back your Acer or until you sell it?

Be very, very careful on Craig's List. I would be quite leery of this listing. This is a $1200 laptop which Newegg is selling as a refurbished (not new) computer for $900. Nowhere in the Craig's List listing does it say whether it is new or used or anything else. Document, document, document everything.

In 15" laptops, the 7600GT was one of those that were replaced. The problem was less extreme in 17" models so they didn't always get put on a ***replacement list***.


No it will require them.


When you find a model number, look it up ***here***.


***The Asus site*** only seems to have drivers for Vista and Windows 7.

I found that on the Asus site the Asus G1 laptop still supports XP but the OS is Windows XP media center edition. Don't know if this would be good for adventure gaming or not.

Can't find the Asus G1 anywhere for sale. Still waiting for the seller's (of the Acer Aspire) manager to get back to me about the return of the laptop. Realized that I'm not ready to use Windows 7 for gaming, I want to stick with Win XP (32-bit) until I get my huge pile of DOS - Win XP games (incl. games like Baron Wittard) played, and then after these are all played I'll be ready to move on to a newer OS. Don't push me, please, Microsoft.

Which ones have you found that will not work on Windows 7?

MS Flight Simulator X Deluxe, 80 Days, Zelenhgorm, Jazz and Faust. But let me say, there's still a chance I may be returning the Acer after all, if I end up stuck with it, I'll work with you guys to get my programs (including XnView - a free multiple screenshot capture program) working in Win 7 the way they did in XP.

Thanks. 80 Days has installed and run perfectly in Windows 7 and is already listed as one that will play. I'd like to include Jazz and Faust in our Windows 7 and Games thread. I know you've tried it in VMWare, but have you tried to do a simple installation directly in Windows 7? I got Sanitarium - a game written for Windows 98 - to install in 64-bit Windows 7 simply by using compatibility mode.

XNView (version 1.97.8) is listed as being compatibile with Vista and Windows 7. Perhaps you just need to download an updated version?

Please let me know about Jazz and Faust. And also why wouldn't 80 Days or Zelenhgorm play for you? Crashes? Error messages?

i'm just going to throw in my 2cents , cruise02 , and no offense is meant ,honestly.

i don't understand how you are going to be a computer tech ,when it seems that when you get in a little bit of a spot ,you change your mind about what to do ?
have you thought of paying for,and taking a computer class at maybe your local school where you could get some solid background and be able to maybe take your laptop in personally for live help?
just a thought to try and help you out....

They may all have croaked by now.
***Problem: G1 and G1S Nvidia cards problem***
I can keep warning you about the problem with Nvidia cards in previous generation laptops, but it's starting to look like you may have to learn by experience. There are worse things than having a modern laptop on which you can't install XP and which doesn't play 100% of your games -- for example a laptop which lasts a few weeks than then gives you no video at all.

If you're going to look for a laptop from the Core Duo/Core 2 Duo generation, look for one with an ATI card. But I'd recommend asking about a modern, current generation laptop that has XP drivers over at notebookreview, where someone may have managed to put XP on their new laptop. Otherwise you're better off using VMware's 3D emulation, or possibly looking into ***3danalyze***, which emulates 3D effects like T&L and could possibly be used inside VMware or VirtualPC.

Just googled for some of the laptop models (Sony, etc) that support Win 7/XP and it seems like Amazon, newegg, etc. just stopped selling the older models - even tried typing in the laptop/desktop models that I own now/owned previously just to see if I'd get any computers for sale on amazon but it's now the same results - just a bunch of parts for these models, not the whole computer itself - what gives?

What gives is that it's time to move on, cruise. XP is a 10 year old operating system which is being fazed out. You have a perfectly good 160 GB ASUS EEE XP Netbook which will do what you keep saying you want to do - play all your older games on XP and it's portable. Why the obsession with having yet another XP system? You have the best of all worlds right now with your various computers... a new modern one that will play new games for several years to come; a recent XP Netbook which will play older games and even your ancient old Dell with the old hardware in case you run into one that doesn't like newer hardware. If you don't move on here, you're going to find yourself not two operating systems behind the times, but several operating systems behind the times. You'll never have a chance of being a computer repair technician. I'll always have an XP and if I want I can put 98SE in a virtual environment. But I no longer use XP as my main operating system as I don't want to be left not knowing how to work with new technology. I can't expect people with Vista and Windows 7 to ask for my help if I don't know anything about them.

I agree with niteowl - if you want to truely learn how to do all this "tinkering," take a class and use their computers to take apart and put back together. Or partition and repartition etc.

Wow, that's the first I've heard about that. I recall the 8600's having issues, but not the 7600 series.

Was it a heating issue?

Hi cruise, I've just bought a new system with Windows 7 in the hope that it will play most of my older games that worked in XP. I'm reassured that most of them will - and if I really want to replay something that won't work I have my '6 year old XP' waiting in the wings. From what you've said so far you seem to have enough equipment to swap around to play older & newer games. You can only play one at a time! The fact is that no one system, whatever you do to it, is going to be capable of playing absolutely everything. If you want to play all of the latest games (which is what you've said you wanted to do) then Windows 7 with lots of memory & a good graphics card is the way to go.

If you buy something from e.g. an Ebay seller & they were honest about the description, you really have no rights to return it unless there is something wrong with it - changing your mind about what you wanted is your problem & not the sellers. I don't think it's fair to keep contacting them to tell them you're not happy, happy, not happy etc & could be seen as harrassment which could get you barred from the site.

I think you should keep the laptop you've bought & if you want to fiddle around try & find some cheap laptops to play with.

From what I can tell, it was the same issue as with the 8600's, only maybe not as extreme. Something to so with heat differential and the way the bumps (that dispersed heat) were arranged on the chips -- over time the heating/cooling cycles put too much stress on the plastic that contained the circuitry -- once the plastic developed a crack, the circuitry would break contact and your video would go bad. It wasn't just a matter of how hot the laptop got as of the difference in temperature between its hottest point (often while gaming) and when it was off.

I don't think they replaced the 7600's and 8600's in most 17" models -- at least I don't recognize any 17" Dell models with the 7600 or 8600 in ***the list***. The Dell Inspiron 1720 is a 17 incher that was sold with an 8600 card, and it's not in their list. The 17" Macbook is in their list (and I think it had an 8600) but the Macbook was very thin and ran hotter than most 17 inchers. The Dell M1710 had a 7900 or 7950 card and the M1730 usually had 8700 cards, so they probably ran hotter than the 8600 in the 1720.

Before I do this, I'm waiting about whether we're going to return the acer laptop, Mom called the bank, the bank said the check (it was paid by check) wasn't cashed yet, but

we got a call from the seller, who listened to the issue of finding XP drivers for my particular model (acer aspire 5745G) especially the NVidia GeForce GT 420M driver, he told me he's going to have his tech try to get these drivers for me, and we don't have to pay for this help - it's a courtesy offered to his customers, and he's going to get back to me Friday afternoon, so hopefully I'm going to keep this laptop and have all the XP (32-bit) drivers for all the hardware.

Because the 420M is a secondary IGP, I sure don't know how he's going to do that. Remember, the only thing your laptop see's is the Intel graphics processor. Optimus takes care of the smoke and mirrors under the covers.

The only drivers that are currently available are specific to Windows 7, there is no XP support.

Edit -

From Device Manager, what devices do you see listed under Display Adapters?

Which probably explains why the warranty does not cover any other operating systems except Windows 7 on this laptop.

In Device manager on my new laptop (XP) now - there's no such listing for "display adapters", but there is a listing marked by a yellow question mark, "other devices", and it has 2 yellow question-marked labeled listings (among 4 other yellow Q-marked labeled items) for "video controller (VGA compatible)". I suspect this is where the Intel HD graphics and the NVidia 420M devices may be hiding.

That's what I suspected you'd see - I know of no drivers for XP that will support the Optimus configuration.

Maybe you can select Update Driver from device manager? It may locate an Intel driver for the primary IGP. If not, the standard VGA driver is probably all you're going to get.

I thought ***this*** was interesting. Apparently it is possible to use the Nvidia graphics in XP as long as the BIOS allows you to switch off Optimus -- as the Lenovo T510 mentioned in that thread does.

Found this -

how to fix nvidia optimus disabled to switch to descrete graphics

but I don't know if this will work, btw, how exactly do I flash nvidia through the bios (I upgraded my Acer bios to v16) rather than windows 7 or XP?

I'd run across that one as well, but I thought I recalled Cruise mentioning that the option was disabled in her BIOS.



I would be very careful flashing the video BIOS - Generally once that's done, it can not be reversed.

It might come enabled if Acer produces a new version of the 5745G BIOS. Cruise02 already flashed to the latest (1.6), but she could keep an eye out to see if they come up with a 1.7.


I agree. If you flash with the wrong BIOS, you may end up with no Nvidia graphics and no way to recover them. I didn't see any video BIOS updates on the Acer site and the one at Nvidia may not be compatible.

Since I deleted the win XP partition, and enlarged the win 7 partition back to original size last weekend when we thought we were going to return the laptop, and afterwards shrunk the win 7 partition again, recreated the XP partition, and talked to the seller over the phone Wed, he told me to email him a list of all hardware devices found in device manager (under XP) so he can pass the list to his tech, and the tech is going to try and hunt down XP drivers. While waiting for the seller's Fri. afternoon phone call, I found that my laptop wouldn't boot into win 7 even after I set it to AHCI mode in the BIOS, and I booted back into XP (after changing to IDE), reinstalled Easy BCD, and tried to fix the Win 7/XP entries, but this wouldn't work, EBCD gave me an error, couldn't detect, so I tried to fix it by removing all entries, rebooted, and after this the computer wouldn't boot up into any OS at all - it told me to insert the Win 7 startup disc (recovery disc) and go from there. So I tried to open the optical drive, it was unresponsive. So I powered off the computer, waited a few minutes, powered back on, and this time the optical drive door slid open. I got my recovery DVD's that I created beforehand (when I first got the laptop) and I used these to recover the system (win 7).

EDIT - the computer seemed to lock up when installing SysPrep - Factory Mode for over an hour or more. So I powered off, powered on, and it booted into windows 7. I then deleted the D: partition (created last weekend for XP), enlarged the Win 7 partition back to original size, and as for this 3D graphics problem in XP, I'm going to use Virtual Box to create a Win XP VM, as Virtual Box will use my host's 3D graphics in the XP guest to run certain games.