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#904825 - 07/31/13 07:56 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: Monokuma]
traveler Online   content
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 3209
Loc: Rivellon
"Can people sell or gift their DRM-free digital games? How can they make sure that the seller doesn't sell the same game multiple times?"

Yes, you can sell or give away a game you've bought.
That's not to say that you should.
The games on GOG, for instance, are sold with no restrictions.
You buy it, it's yours.
GOG, DotEmu, some others, depend on the buyer's honor.

"So if that company doesn't exist anymore, does the online store continue to sell the game and keep all the money for themselves, or they stop selling the game and the game disappears?"

As long as the rights to a game belong to someone and they've sold those rights or given them, outright or for a percentage of the profits, to an online distributor, the game can continue to be sold.
It's sometimes very tricky to find out who does have the rights to a game.
They can't be sold without them so if a legal owner can't be determined for a game, and it's probably an old one, it won't be available for sale unless it's on disk and being sold someplace like Ebay.

My understanding of it.


Gil.



_________________________
"Best not to think about it. I don't want to fall to bits 'cos of excess existential thought."

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#904854 - 07/31/13 09:41 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: traveler]
Marian Online   content
Moderator
Graduate Boomer

Registered: 07/04/00
Posts: 19570
Loc: near Yosemite in California
welcome to GameBoomers, Monokuma.

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#904873 - 07/31/13 10:34 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
BrownEyedTigre Online   happy
The Sassy Global Moderator PR Liaison
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 01/04/04
Posts: 64476
Loc: In the Naughty Corner
Monokumo, welcome to GameBoomers.

Regarding GoG or any other download, you may not sell them or trade them, they are "yours" not meant to be sold or traded.

What you are allowed to do is make a "backup". A backup is just that, it's a backup to save you from having to have to redownload.

As stated on GoG's website:

Quote:
2. Can I re-download my purchased games? Is there a limit to the number of re-downloads?
You can always re-download games bought at GOG.com via the “My account” page. Also, there is no limit to the number of redownloads, but please remember that you're not allowed to share your GOG.com account with other users as only you are entitled to download games from your account.

4. Can I make backups of games downloaded from GOG.com?
Yes you can, and as a matter of fact we strongly recommend you do so – backing up your stuff is a very good habit, you know? Because our games are DRM-free, as soon as you download the setup file, you can back it up on a DVD or your external hard drive without hassle. Plus, as our installers are wrapped in nice .exe files, you can save them all in one folder and create a nice local backup of your games library!
And if you forgot to backup your purchased games, fear not. You can always redownload them from our website for free – see below for more info. Sure, downloading will take a little bit longer than launching an installer from your backup disc, but that's no big deal.
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#904881 - 07/31/13 11:04 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: chrissie]
gremlin Offline

Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1613
Loc: Isle of Man
Originally Posted By: chrissie
I myself tend to store passwords in a small address book & shortcuts to download games in a folder on my desktop which automatically list in alphabetical order.


As a computer systems professional in RL (former games developer, pharmaceuticals IT consultant, warehousing & logistics programmer, and now financial web systems programmer/designer with a serious interest in online security), I have to say that using a small address book kept securely is FAR and away the safest, most secure, way to store passwords. Never use the same password on two different sites, never store passwords on your PC (or 'in the cloud'). And never, ever, ever send a password by email. (Email is little more than an open postcard that gets copied an un-knowable number of times between you sending it, and it arriving!)

On the other hand, all these people using spreadsheets for organising data make me snigger (not in a bad, offensive, insulting way, I hope), because spreadsheets were meant for the calculating functionality they offer, and that you're all avoiding. What you're talking about is using it as a database - a completely different beast. Still, horses for courses: if the spreadsheet works for you, do it smile (afterall, the guys & gals who invented computers and the web never envisioned GameBoomers, now did they)

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#904893 - 07/31/13 11:30 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: BrownEyedTigre]
traveler Online   content
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 3209
Loc: Rivellon
Ana,

Can and may are two different things.

Just saying.

Gil.
_________________________
"Best not to think about it. I don't want to fall to bits 'cos of excess existential thought."

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#904900 - 07/31/13 11:46 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
BrownEyedTigre Online   happy
The Sassy Global Moderator PR Liaison
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 01/04/04
Posts: 64476
Loc: In the Naughty Corner
Gil, you stated they are sold without restrictions. That is incorrect. It specifically states you may not share your account. That covers copying your disks and selling and trading them. Copying to a disk is for your personal backup only.

It is indeed based on an honor system.
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#904902 - 07/31/13 11:59 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: BrownEyedTigre]
GreyFuss Offline
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 06/01/06
Posts: 2918
Originally Posted By: BrownEyedTigre
Gil, you stated they are sold without restrictions. That is incorrect. It specifically states you may not share your account. That covers copying your disks and selling and trading them. Copying to a disk is for your personal backup only.

It is indeed based on an honor system.


thumbsup
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#904904 - 07/31/13 12:13 PM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
traveler Online   content
Addicted Boomer

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 3209
Loc: Rivellon
I think you know what I mean Ana.
In no way did I say that you are justified in giving away or selling a game you buy though you physically can.
Saying "you may not" isn't going to stop anyone who intends to do either.
As I said, they are relying on the buyer's honor.

Gil.
_________________________
"Best not to think about it. I don't want to fall to bits 'cos of excess existential thought."

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#904909 - 07/31/13 12:23 PM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
BrownEyedTigre Online   happy
The Sassy Global Moderator PR Liaison
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 01/04/04
Posts: 64476
Loc: In the Naughty Corner
I do understand what you are saying Gil, but to someone reading the post and not not fully processing it it appears as though you are saying they are free to sell or trade. I know from past experiences that many skim posts and I needed to clarify that your statement below is not accurate.

Originally Posted By: traveler
"Can people sell or gift their DRM-free digital games? How can they make sure that the seller doesn't sell the same game multiple times?"

Yes, you can sell or give away a game you've bought.

Gil.


That's like taking a kid to the candy store and they ask if they can eat any candy they see without buying it. You wouldn't say yes you can just because it's physically possible, you would say no because it's the wrong thing to do.
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#904947 - 07/31/13 03:51 PM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
lanlynk Offline
Settled Boomer

Registered: 03/07/13
Posts: 295
Loc: Alaska
Some companies actually have a system to gift digital games to someone else. I bought a couple of games for my sister from Steam that way. The recipient of the gift receives the activation code, and of course, has to have an account with Steam. These are legitimate ways to give someone a legal copy of a game.

Originally Posted By: gremlin
On the other hand, all these people using spreadsheets for organising data make me snigger (not in a bad, offensive, insulting way, I hope), because spreadsheets were meant for the calculating functionality they offer, and that you're all avoiding. What you're talking about is using it as a database - a completely different beast.

Point well taken. I've considered making a database for my game inventory and for my books, but at this point, I haven't wanted to make the effort. What happened with me, was my list started out simple and then just mushroomed. rolleyes
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"Dragons were never gone. They were just invisible and very, very quiet." ~ M'aiq the Liar (Skyrim)

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#904955 - 07/31/13 04:04 PM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: lanlynk]
Mad Offline
True Blue Boomer

Registered: 11/21/00
Posts: 23210
Loc: United Kingdom
"Point well taken. I've considered making a database for my game inventory and for my books, but at this point, I haven't wanted to make the effort. What happened with me, was my list started out simple and then just mushroomed. rolleyes"

I keep a "computer document" (titles listed in alphabetical order) of my game collection and just update it as I acquire or dispose of games.

Knowing from the title what type of game it is I've found that's all I've ever needed.

[ Of course I do keep a back up of it on a tiny flash drive and have to update that too laugh ]
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#905061 - 08/01/13 05:53 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: lanlynk]
gremlin Offline

Addicted Boomer

Registered: 11/06/01
Posts: 1613
Loc: Isle of Man
Originally Posted By: lanlynk
Point well taken. I've considered making a database for my game inventory and for my books, but at this point, I haven't wanted to make the effort. What happened with me, was my list started out simple and then just mushroomed. rolleyes

I've heard that reason many times wink

Regarding the gifting thing, Gamers Gate sometimes (maybe always, I've only bought one game from them so can't categorically state 'always') offer the ability to gift the game you've just bought to a friend if you do it within five minutes. I bought Skyrim from them in a sale, but didn't notice this facility until about ten minutes afterwards frown

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#905086 - 08/01/13 08:17 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
Monokuma Offline
Junior Boomer

Registered: 07/29/13
Posts: 5
The thing I don't understand is why the companies, especially the small ones, refuse to sell their games on physical media. And let's assume that retail distribution isn't worth their trouble, then why don't they sell hand-made physical releases, like WadgetEye Games? I can't accept that a company able to produce a video game can't afford a $100 printer and a $20 dvd burner. After all we as customers are willing to pay the extra cost plus the shipping, so it doesn't really affect their earnings.

And as for retail releases, how come I can find retail versions in all the major European languages EXCEPT English? How can localized retail versions in Italian, French, German, Spanish, Russian etc be financially viable while an English retail isn't? There are 50mil Italian speaking people, whereas there are 500mil native English speaking people and about 500mil with English as a secondary language. East European, Middle Eastern and African countries all play games in English too.

When gamers ask for boxed versions, people and companies label them "collectors" or even worse "hoarders" and look down upon them. In all the kickstarters I have ever checked out the lowest tier for a physical version is the $100 tier (without counting shipping most of the times), and the logic behind it is that if you're a collector you must be willing to spend big money. But having the game on a disc isn't collecting. 10-15 years ago the same companies based their campaigns against piracy by telling us how stupid it is to have a game on a no-name cdr with its name handwritten with a marker on top of it, instead of a nice big box with nice artwork and goodies inside. And now they are selling us exactly that, refusing us the alternative.

And as for adventure games, how come every low budget casual hidden object game gets an English retail release, but NOT if it is a full fledged adventure game?

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#905166 - 08/01/13 04:34 PM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: JohnBoy]
MaG Offline
Administrator
Sonic Boomer

Registered: 12/28/99
Posts: 65698
Monokuma,

For all your questions: it is purely economics.

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#905262 - 08/02/13 12:47 AM Re: Are boxed versions of games still being produced? [Re: MaG]
Homer6 Offline
BAAG Specialist

Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 5467
Loc: Oklahoma, USA
Monokuma it's a bit more complicated that a $100 printer and a $20 DVD burner. Someone has to design the graphics for the box, and someone has to approve it. A graphics firm would more than likely be hired to design several possible covers, and submit them for approval.

And you'll find that your $100 printer isn't going to print the necessary graphics for as heavy material used for boxed games. This work would more than likely be farmed out since the necessary printers would be very cost prohibitive.

As to the $20 DVD burner, which burns one DVD at a time. How about a DVD burner that has the capability of burning 20 or more an hour--as an example. This is something else that would be farmed out to those companies which do this as their business.

Someone deciding to get into the business of producing games can't afford all the machinery necessary to do what I described above. Nor can they afford the upkeep those machines would need. And machinery isn't their only concern. There may also be rent, salaries, utilities, suppliers, etc.

Most of these companies are bare bones companies which are counting every penny in order to stay in business. Even a down turn in their product can threaten their very existence.

A person would think it an easy process to provide boxed games. But unless a person has had a business, they don't realize all that must be considered, especially in such a market as computer games.
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