It's going to be some time for me to get a new system. Life happens... Anyway, I was looking at the game Cognition and it demands 1GB of video memory. A few other games wanted more graphic ram than I have as well (256).

I was wondering if I could replace my nvidia 7900GS with a cheap card with more memory and not lose performance value.

Specifically, I was looking at this card -- http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125427 and hoping I could play some of these other games. http://www.amazon.com/EVGA-GeForce-Mini-...graphics+card-- Or this one

What do you think?

I understand... sometimes life just doesn't let you go out and plop down money for an awesome gaming computer.

A couple of questions first... does your motherboard support these video card interfaces? And do you have enough wattage in your power supply?

Sharon the first card you linked to requires 300W of power, while the second one requires a minimum of 300W. You have to also take into account all the other things your power supply runs, so unless you have a power supply larger than 300W you might find running either of these two a bit difficult. Also, both require a PCI slot.

And specifically a PCI-E 2.0 slot...

I had a 400 watt power supply put in when I got my 7900GS. I know I have a PCI-E slot, but don't know the version number.

I don't know the quality of the cards I'm looking at. The card I have is labled a mid-range (in 2007/2008) while the cards I'm looking at are labled entry level or low level. I don't want to trade down for the sake of some extra ram.

My current card is a PNY.

In that case either card is fine. It would be good to know your PCI-E version though. Do you have info on the model of your motherboard?

While ether card will supply the required ram specs, neither will perform as well as your current card, they have a very narrow 64 bit memory bus.

If you can afford something slightly more expensive, and have room in the case for it, I'd look at something like this -

GeForce GTS 450

It's not the fastest card out there, but is an improvement compared to your current card. Newegg has one available for $60.00 after a mail in rebate.

I love it when Inland is here - I always learn something new! While certainly nothing to write home about, I would have thought these newer cards would perform at least a little better than the 7900GS.

Thanks, Inland.
Too many people think new cards outperform old ones just because they're new, when it isn't true at all.

Only thing I wonder about is whether the GTS 450 will work with only a 400 Watt power supply.
I didn't see a minimum power supply listed at
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814134119

I don't know if it's still happening, but I remember something about them simply rebranding the older cards with new numbers with virtually no improvements at one time.

It's in the link I posted (near the bottom) -

Thermal and Power Specs


Maximum GPU Temperature (in C) 100 C
Maximum Graphics Card Power (W) 106 W
Minimum System Power Requirement (W) 400 W
Supplementary Power Connectors 6-pin

I wish Newegg and other retailers would publish that info along with the product. I've had to go to the manufacturer more than once to find it.

Thanks, Inland.
And I completely agree, Draclvr.
What makes it worse is when one manufacturer says one thing and another manufacturer says another about cards with the same chipset.

It can be a pain, can't it. And.. BTW - GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator I've enjoyed the reviews, you've got the knack.

Who knew Jenny could not only fix our computer glitches, but could also turn quite a phrase! I've been enjoying them too.

Thanks Inland, Jenny, Draclvr. This looks like a good card. My motherboard is an Intel D915GAG (12E1) per Speccy. I'll see if I can scratch together enough money to get this card. The rebate is only available till 12/31.

I appreciate all the info and advice.

Sharon

This is what the specs say for this motherboard...

The boards provide the following PCI Express connectors:
•One PCI Express x16 connector supporting simultaneous transfer speeds up to 8 GBytes/sec
•Two PCI Express x1 connectors. The x1 interfaces support simultaneous transfer speeds up to 500 MBytes/sec

So, it doesn't have PCI-E 2.0, but I believe they are backwards compatible. I don't know what, if anything, you would sacrifice by not having 2.0.

We'll have to wait for Inland to drop by!

Yep, the card is backward compatible, just make sure the case will accommodate the additional side of the card for the fan.

Here's a link that shows the card -

NVIDIA GeForce GTS 450 1GB DDR5 PCI Express (PCIe)

Edit -

If the case wont accommodate the fan, you could always consider one of the Radeon cards -

AMD Radeon HD 6670
AMD Radeon HD 7750

Newegg has a 6670 for $54.99 after rebate - either will run on a 400 watt power supply.

Thanks for the information, Inland and Draclver. All things being equal, I would like to stay with Nvidia. I honestly can't say if there is room in there for the fan or not. I'll have to open the system up tomorrow and have a look. It will be a good chance to dust it out as well. If it looks like it will fit I will go ahead and order it tomorrow.

Thanks again, Sharon

(I just dread having to unplug all my connections to get a look inside...) I should do it anyway, cause I'm not sure I have the modem/router setup correctly.

Well, thats torn it! My computer died! I looked inside the pc for the size of my current card and dusted it out. Put it back and now it will not turn on! I was afraid of this. I checked the connections and they are ok.

I have to get a new cheap pc. I am going to buy a wa550b ibuypower pc for $530 from walmart, unless you think I can do better for the same amt of money. Can not pay more at this time. I am using my galaxy tab 2 to get on the internet in the meantime.

Sharon

Hi Sharon,
You probably already checked this but I have to mention it anyway:

Some Computers have a safety Power Button in the back and when one sometimes moves the computer or cleans it, one might hit the switch by mistake.

It was a good thought, Starcom. I tried it but it still wont turn on. It tried to, but it did not succeed. Thanks for the reminder.

If it's plugged into a power strip, make sure that's on too.
If it's possible a screw or wire got loose inside the computer, that could cause a short.

Looking at this from a purely logical point of view,if it worked before you dusted and now it doesn't logic says you bumped some kind of connector and knocked it loose.You should push all the connectors on and check to see if you didn't knock the very small connectors at the bottom of the motherboard coming from the start button loose.
Also Cyberpower had a computer called "Back To School Special" for about $535 and it included Windows.It seemed like a pretty good computer for the price.Some of their prices don't have windows included,you have to watch for that.I am mentioning that because all componants are upgradable.I am not sure of that in the other computer you mentioned.

I'll bet something got knocked loose somewhere too...

Meanwhile, you could put one together for about $560 at eCollegePC with an Nvidia GTX 650 video card and Windows 7. I looked for that Back to School special and it is now $669 and I think the video card is pretty low-end... it's AMD R7 240 2GB Graphics. But I don't know much about AMD graphics.

Wow it really jumped in price for some reason. Well forget that one.That collegePC sounds good.

Well, it has a low end - but decent - processor and I'm not fond of the power supply either. But if Sharon is on a tight budget, then it will do.

I did not find the system you mentioned, draclvr. Can you provide a link? I was looking at the system for S640, with the 1tb hdd for an extra S10. I might be able to get the extra S100 if you think it would be a significant improvement?

just saw that this does not come with os. I tried customizing it with a few minor improvements and it came to S854. Cant do it.

Sharon, here is what I did... I clicked on the Value Series in the Intel heading. AMD would be fine too - I'm just not as familiar with those components. I then clicked on the $345 one. I left everything as stock, added in the video card and the operating system. You could save $30 on the OS if you go to Newegg right now and grab a copy of 64-bit Windows 7 Home Premium for $80 and install it yourself. You would have to create an account and enter the Promo Code EMCWVWX22 at checkout. The Promo Code expires on 12/16. If you did that, you could possibly have enough money to upgrade the processor or the power supply.

I assume you're looking at that AMD system for $640 - if so, it does not have an operating system or a stand alone video card. You would have to add those in.

I take it you couldn't figure out what might have come disconnected or knocked out of place? Or have you just gotten new computer fever!

The system had been acting up for some time. I was afraid to turn it off because it didnt want to turn back on, it kept rebooting for no reason while it was sitting idle. Not a lot, but every now and then,

anyway, I did not want to put more money into it. Thanks for the info about the os.

edit-Do I need a wireless adapter? I have a router and 2 modems and I no longer know what does what.
I need wifi for my kindle and tab, but they still work even though my pc is broken.

If the Kindle were connecting to the Internet through your PC, it wouldn't have Internet when the PC was off (or kaput).
So unless you want your PC connected wirelessly, you wouldn't need the wireless adapter. Just use the same cable the current PC is using to connect to the Internet.

And that iBuyPower computer at Walmart isn't horrible. At least it has a stand alone Nvidia GT 630 graphics card. I don't know how much better that is than your current card is though. Inland will have to weigh in on that. Should you decide to have eCollegePC build one, try to get the best video card you can afford. With your tight budget you will have to weigh different options.

I found some reviews for the ibuypower wa550b here
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/allReviews.do?product_id=23745948

One person mentions that it comes with a 300 Watt power supply. If you ever want to upgrade the graphics card, you'd have to upgrade the power supply also. The GT 630 is a "value" card for "entry level" gaming according to ***Geforce***. It's probably adequate for most adventure games, though you might have to reduce video options to play something like the latest Sherlock Holmes game.

The GT 630 can come with either 1GB or 2GB of video memory and either DDR3 or DDR5. I suspect the GT 630 in the wa550b is the 1GB version with DDR3 since they're trying to keep prices down. The GT 630 is one of those "rebranded" video cards (a rebranded GT 440 according to ***Wikipedia***).

GPUReview doesn't list the GT 630, but they do list the GT 440. Although the GT 630 has more video memory than your old 7900GS, it does not look like a faster card to me
http://www.gpureview.com/show_cards.php?card1=642&card2=443

If it was me, I'd try to find a configuration at eCollege (or possibly CyberpowerPC) that had a better graphics card and power supply. But if money is tight, the wa550b will work.

This item description from Wal Mart says it has the 2 GB GT 630...

iBuypower at Walmart

I have decided to cancel my walmart order and get something frrom ecollege. I have already ordered win 7 from newegg during their promotion. I'm going to try for a better system. Thanks for all the info and advice. I was panicing about being without a computer.

I know the feeling! If you have any questions at all, just post back here.

I'm leaving tomorrow morning to head up to NW Iowa 600 miles away to spend some time with my mom and my son who is flying in from Denver. Not nearly cold enough here, so I'm going where it's well below zero! But I'm taking my Surface tablet with me and will have email access and Jenny and Inland actually know way more than I do. There are some corners you can cut for right now to keep the cost down with an eye to upgrading later, but just get the best you can afford right now.

Thanks Draclvr. Have a good time on your trip. I'm going to try to be patient as I can be. I'm also going thru game withdrawal. Tried a couple games on my tab, but I don't like the touchscreen. Slowly getting used to the tab. Thank heaven I can still get online. I don't understand how I still have a wifi connection without a working computer. But the tab tells me it is usiing my wifi connection.

Thanks again to you and Jenny for all your help.

Sharon

You don't need a computer for a WiFi connection. All you need is a WiFi router putting out the signal for all your wireless devices to pick up.

I'll be checking in here at least once a day and like I said, Jenny and Inland know way more than I do. So go ahead and start putting something together and checking back here with questions!

Does the PC attempt to power up? Fans and hard drive spin up?

Yes, if I turn the button on the back off and on and then press the start button on the front it will start to powerup, the fans all turn on and it may even start to boot up. Then it shuts off within the minute.

I opened the pc back up and checked that the connections were plugged in all the way and they were. I called a pc service company and they are going to come out today to take a look. They mentioned the power supply and that makes sense. I can only hope it is a simple repair.

Remember you can always go bigger on a PS but never smaller.

Thanks Geo. I priced power supplies at newegg and they have a thermaltek 600W one for $45. Don't know if it will work in my system, but the price is right. Just have to find out if this actually the cause of the problem. Then get it installed. Power supply installation is beyond my tech level.

Edit: Well the computer guy confirmed that my power supply had gone bad. He ran a diagnostic on the motherboard and said there were no problems with it. He checked out the ps that I was going to get and said my video card needed more amps than that ps put out (20A). So I'm going with the 700W ps with (53A).

So it looks like I will again have a working system by the end of the month. Keeping my fingers and toes crossed,

Sharon

53A??!! Are you sure you didn't get a whole house generator by mistake?

This sounds like some component may be overheating -- probably either the processor or the video card.


If the thermal compound on the processor has dried up or is no longer making contact, it's just as well to have someone else replace it.

.

He said that was the output amps and I looked at the specs and that is what it said. Is that unusual?

Jenny, is it possible for the processor to have lost tight connection or be "broken" and for the motherboard to test ok?

I guess it is possible. I just divided 700w by 12v and got 58a. I didnt think they put out that much.

Since I have to replace my power supply, I would still like to upgrade my video card. Would a 650ti work in ny system? If so, can you suggest a good replacement? There is nothing in the next slot on my motherboard, so a fan should not present a problem.

Thanks, Sharon

It's a pretty big card, so make sure it will fit. Also be sure there is enough cooling if your old case is a small one.

My current card is pretty big per my tech. Also, what would be enough cooling? My current card has a fan, my cpu and ps have fans. And I have one fan for the case, My ram has heat spreaders as well.

I don't know how to tell if there is enough room. Or enough cooling. Do I need to go to a card without a fan to be on the safe side? I really would like to stay with nvidea. Do you have any recommendations?

You may have to measure. If your current card is cramped for space, and the card you're getting is bigger, you may have difficulties.


Just the opposite. If you get a card without a fan, you have to be extra sure your case is well ventilated. A card that is only cooled by its heat sink is more dependent on the ambient temperature inside the computer case for cooling.

A 650Ti will run just fine on a PSU with 20Amps on the 12 volt rail. So long as the case has a slot cover that can be removed to accommodate the fan you shouldn't have any issues.

My concern is that if this case is getting crowded, if her case only has one small exhaust fan in the back, there might be temperature issue. All the fans you mention are moving heat from the component to the inside of the case. The problem might be moving the beat OUT of the case.

Yeah, I know what you mean - that one is always a concern. I ran into a similar issue after I upgraded my soundcard. It sits right next to my video card, and it runs a bit hotter now.

Getting a new card for my old system seems to be problematic. I don't want to have to return the card if it won't fit or makes the case run hot. I think I'll wait for my next system to have a better video card. I'm going to get a new system as soon as possible. Thanks to all who gave their time and attention to this matter.

UPDATE: My system is working again!!! Turned out to be a bad power supply. That's been replaced and I'm up and running again. Still need a new system and am going to make that my priority for the New Year! Thanks all for your help and advice. I'm going to need more advice going forward as I try to compromise between what I want and what I can reasonably manage cost-wise.

Sharon

Hurrah !! Up and running again sounds just GREAT !!

Excellent, Sharon! A power supply is a quick and easy fix that should get you by until you get a shiny new computer. Now you can take your time in picking out a new system.

Easy to say, Draclvr. I've been picking up different options, small improvements on a build at ecollege and the price keeps getting higher. There are just some things I feel I must have. I am intending to get an Nvidea 770 2GB card for sure.

Sharon