Live vs Look

Posted by: Philippe Gaude - Galilea

Live vs Look - 01/22/04 11:53 AM

I'm always eager to learn, so I guess it's time for me to reverse roles and ask the question : what do you feel great in first person perspective ? what do you feel annoying ? What do you feel great in 3rd person pespective ? What do you feel annoying ?
Posted by: gatorlaw

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 12:38 PM

It depends. I like at least a combined perspective. 3rd person in the cut scenes, 1st person in the actions.

I do generally like 3rd person games the best. I get more involved in the story if I can see the character than if I think I am the character. That varies a great deal between players though.

With 1st person the advantage is a tighter view of items, places and such. Very nice with a 360 degree mouse turn (which this game has)

This game has no action moments, but when they are present in a game - 1st person is very difficult. Hard to jump or leap accurately when you can't see your feet.

Other than that - it matters more to me about the story, music, game play and interactions with characters and such.
Posted by: Fairygdmther

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 01:03 PM

I agree with gatorlaw - 1st person in the games scenes, and 3rd person in the cut scenes. Sometimes when you are working in just the 3rd person, the character actually gets in your way of seeing or using some item.
Posted by: gatorlaw

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 01:07 PM

the character actually gets in your way of seeing or using some item.
That is a very good point. It is a definite disadvantage to a pure 3rd person perspective game. Particularly in adventure games where you spend so much time looking at items and interacting with them.
Posted by: MDAMLADY

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 02:01 PM

I agree with gatorlaw about the 1st and 3rd person perspective.
Posted by: Philippe Gaude - Galilea

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 02:15 PM

Has any of you played "Omikron, The Nomad Soul" ?
Posted by: Funktion

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 02:31 PM

I did. Great game, although some of the "action" parts were a little weak.

Regarding the topic, 3rd person vs 1st person isn't an issue to me, since I play a game with either of these perspectives, as long as it's good.

If you ask me, I would like to see a few more games like the Shenmue series (my all-time favourite games), in which you play mainly in a 3rd person perspective, but when you want to search/examine something you can use a 1st person perspective (kind of like a "look" key).
Posted by: Jenny100

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 02:41 PM

In 3rd person, I like being able to see the face of the person who's speaking. One of the disappointing things about TLJ and Black Mirror was that you never got a good look at the characters' faces during conversations.

In both 1st and 3rd person games, I like to be able to get closeups of things in the environment. One of the problems with Journey to the Center of the Earth was that you couldn't tell what you were clicking on until after you picked it up. There wasn't even a pop-up label to tell you what that little dark spot in the environment might be.

Journey to the Center of the Earth also had that terrible movement system where the character would rotate in circles. When she moved, it had to be along certain paths. She couldn't go directly where you clicked her, and this caused her to get stuck sometimes.

Screen exits were sometimes difficult to find in Journey to the Center of the Earth. They weren't consistently at the edge of the screen.

I'm picking on that one game, but it is a good example of problems that can occur in a 3rd person game. (Also, I played it recently so I remember it.)

Waiting while a character walks or jogs across the screen can get old when there are a lot of screens to cross to solve a puzzle.

Not being able to identify thingumabobs in inventory is a problem in some games. It's worse in sci-fi games, but can happen in any game. I don't like having "oh that's what that thing is" moments.

One problem that I had with Nancy Drew Haunted Carousel was that there wasn't any continuity between game locations. You had to use a game map to get places, even if you were going to the building right next to the one you were in. Since the entire game took place in an amusement park, it would have been better to let the player move between buildings without the map. The exclusive use of the map to get around ruined any sensation of being in a haunted amusement park.
Posted by: Jen in Chgo

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 03:21 PM

Also depends on whether it's point-n-click or keyboard controlled. Moving 3rd person via keyboard can be a bear. Speaking from head still hurts from walking into walls.

laugh Love, Jen laugh
Posted by: Philippe Gaude - Galilea

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 03:29 PM

If I ever end up producing a 3rd person game, I guess my first step will be to find a system that prevent your character from doing things like bumping into walls of falling from cliffs. I find it difficult to feel anything toward a puppet
Posted by: Philippe Gaude - Galilea

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 03:32 PM

Jenny is right, the map is a tricky problem. It can easily make you lose the feeling of being somewhere. I hope we have done it right in Jack the Ripper. We tried a mix of interconnected places and separate places.
Posted by: gatorlaw

Re: Live vs Look - 01/22/04 05:41 PM

I think you have done a good job of blending the ease of inter-locational transitions and open exploration within each discrete game locale.

Great points, Jenny100.

I also found the lack of open ended movement in Haunted Carousel and games like that to be confining. I was glad they went back to more exploratory pathways and side venues in DODI.

In Jack the Ripper, you hit the barrier or exit point of a locale and your cursor changes to a map icon. But within each environment, the panning feature and multiple walkways keeps you from feeling claustrophobic or bound. You can go into rooms and look around, even though there may be nothing or no one to interact with in that area.

I haven't gone to an outside location yet - that's what comes next as far as the leads tell me. I am looking forward to these areas to see how they feel compared to the interior places.
Posted by: nickie

Re: Live vs Look - 01/23/04 10:57 AM

I agree with Funktion, in that I prefer third person, but a tap of the button to see a first person perspective is helpful at times. Morrowind is so interesting in that you can play from either perspective with a single key tap - that sort of thing might make everyone happy.
Posted by: Philippe Gaude - Galilea

Re: Live vs Look - 01/23/04 11:11 AM

in fact, if you provide this option you end up designing all your locations for one or the other, generally 3rd person view with some places where 1st person is mandatory. It's really hard to have a location architecture fitting both perspectives.
Posted by: mszv

Re: Live vs Look - 01/24/04 01:35 PM

For me,whether the game is first person or third person depends more on the game than on the perpective. If I am playing as myself, I want it to be first person. If I am playing as another person, but who that person is is not important to the game or story, then I want it to be first person. An example where I played as another person was, I believe, Amerzone. I think I was supposed to be a certain journalist, but who I was had little to do with the game, so first person worked nicely. Now, in Syberia, Kate, the protagonist, has a strong role in the game, and she has a distinct personality, apart from me, so I want to be able to see her.

In either view I'd like to have closeups of things and scenes, when I need them. I also like to all the characters faces.

In an online game, I want to be able to switch between first and third person. Sometimes I want the immediate experience of first person, sometimes I want to see my avatar as others see it.

What a great new forum. Philippe, what a pleasure to correspond with you!
Posted by: Jenny100

Re: Live vs Look - 01/24/04 05:59 PM

Motion sickness can occur with any first person game that uses transitions, panning, or real time 3D movement. It's very important to have speed controls to minimize motion sickness. It also helps for movement to be smooth. "Bobbing" is bad, as is jerky movement. Not everyone is susceptible to motion sickness, but for those who are, it is a major concern to be able to slow down and smooth out movement.
Posted by: gatorlaw

Re: Live vs Look - 01/24/04 11:20 PM

The panning is very smooth and there appears to be a motion speed control feature. I liked the speed I had with the default mode - which is set in the mid range, so I left it where it was.