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Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes #1092281
12/09/16 11:05 AM
12/09/16 11:05 AM
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GreyFuss Offline OP
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Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes

Has anyone heard of this and what does it really mean in simpler terms? I still go through each update one at a time when I do a Windows Update search to weed out the ones Microsoft calls something like prepping for upgrades and I uncheck anything that looks like it pertains to any OS upgrades.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/...oo#3c702dd95331


"Don't Hate Me Because I Am Beautiful...There Are Many Other Reasons!"
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092282
12/09/16 11:34 AM
12/09/16 11:34 AM
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Draclvr Offline
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Yes, I've read about it. It will be a win for people like you and me who only want the security updates.


Pulling weeds in the flower beds!
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092285
12/09/16 11:50 AM
12/09/16 11:50 AM
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GreyFuss Offline OP
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Hi Tomato Queen

But how does that work? Can't they still slip you a mickey so to speak?


"Don't Hate Me Because I Am Beautiful...There Are Many Other Reasons!"
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092293
12/09/16 12:54 PM
12/09/16 12:54 PM
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Just used your link, thank you, GreyFuss, and Hurrah !! Hurrah !! Hurrah !! bravo12


Time : The Most Precious Commodity
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092294
12/09/16 01:05 PM
12/09/16 01:05 PM
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Draclvr Offline
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Who knows, GreyFuss... vigilance is ours to do!


Pulling weeds in the flower beds!
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092295
12/09/16 01:07 PM
12/09/16 01:07 PM
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Microsoft has already included telemetry (what some call spying) in the same "security" updates that are necessary to get Windows Update working at all.

Each "security rollup" has a KB number, even though it contains more than one update, according to this article at Technet.
*** More on Windows 7 and Windows 8.1 servicing changes ***

Supposedly the "security rollups" were Microsoft's answer to "fragmented patching.
But this "Woody on Windows" article at Infoworld explains how "fragmented patching" actually came about, and how it was Micosoft's fault:
*** Blame Microsoft--not users--for fragmented patching in Windows 7 and 8.1 ***

The "rollups" are Microsoft's answer to Windows users selecting which updates they want in order to avoid telemetry (or in the past, unwanted Windows 10 installation). Since Microsoft has mislabeled telemetry installation as a "security update" in the past, there's no reason to think they won't include it in the "rollups." From Woody's article...

Originally Posted By: Woody
Then Win7 and 8.1 customers got hit with a double whammy: The "Get Windows 10" campaign and the further encroachment of Microsoft snooping. Patching has never been the same since. Customers started implementing defensive patching strategies -- protecting themselves from Microsoft's advances -- and the nature of patching changed completely.

There's fragmentation, but it's largely predictable and almost entirely dedicated to the idea of keeping Microsoft's hands off their systems.

I see two general camps of Win7 and 8.1 defensive patchers. On the one hand, there are people who will only install clearly identified security patches. On the other, we have people who have followed (or developed) long lists of patches that should be avoided to deflect Microsoft's privacy incursions. Many people refuse to install patches that are specifically designed to make the transition to Windows 10 easier: They bought and paid for Win7, and they don't want Win10.

Patch blocklists abound -- and no longer just among the tinfoil hat wearers. They reflect a genuine concern about Microsoft's new telemetry activities: the Diagnostic and Telemetry tracking service, for example; new telemetry points/snooping stations; and Visual Studio Application Insights. Many Windows 7 and 8.1 users don't see any reason to let Microsoft (or app developers) snoop any more than they already do.

So yes, there is fragmentation in patching now. But I don't think it's a case of Win7 users deciding that they want to support the Azerbaijani manat or skip the daylight savings time updates for rural Egypt. The fragmentation that's developed has a pattern, and it's due to Microsoft's intrusiveness.

Now that the "Get Windows 10" campaign is over, Microsoft has a golden opportunity to mend some fences and pull the extraneous garbage out of Win7 and 8.1. A couple months' of healing patches that get the Win10 junk out of Win7 and reduce the telemetry incursion would do wonders to reduce the fragmentation.

I don't expect that to happen. Instead we're going to see Microsoft consolidate its snooping efforts under a new banner, with fragmentation cast as the boogeyman.


Here's Woody's advice for operating the new patching system.
*** How to prepare for the Windows 7/8.1 ‘patchocalypse’ ***
So if you're not worried about Microsoft "spying" you can use Windows update.
If you only want the security updates you have to download them manually.

The link to Woody's article on how to browse the update catalog is here
*** How to check the Microsoft Update Catalog with any browser ***

So manual patching to avoid anything that might include telemetry has become much more difficult.
Of course if you trust Microsoft and don't care what information they might be collecting about you or your computer, or who they "share" the information with, you can get patches from Windows update.

Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092299
12/09/16 01:30 PM
12/09/16 01:30 PM
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Who knows what to believe... one person whose opinions I take with a couple of pounds of salt is Kelly at Forbes Magazine.

From Ed Bott at ZDNet...

http://www.zdnet.com/article/is-windows-10-telemetry-a-threat-to-your-personal-privacy/

Quote:
The argument for a telemetry kill switch baffles me, as does the implication that telemetry data is inherently at odds with personal privacy.

As far as I can tell, that "off switch" already exists, and when it's flipped to the correct position, I believe there's virtually no chance that Windows 10 telemetry information constitutes even a remote privacy issue.

In fact, there are more privacy protections in the telemetry framework for Windows 10 than there were in earlier Windows versions. I described these privacy options several weeks ago, but will repeat that section in its entirety here, because it's worth reading carefully, and because Adrian's post doesn't seem to have considered the privacy protections already available in Windows 10.


And from the same article...

Quote:
In earlier Windows versions, the telemetry system was known as Windows Error Reporting, which traces its ancestry to the Dr. Watson feature from the earliest days of Windows.


Again, who knows what to believe.


Pulling weeds in the flower beds!
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092301
12/09/16 01:41 PM
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GreyFuss Offline OP
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Oh Crimeny, now I am even more confused but in some way I think thats what they want. Just confuse the masses that don't know much about this, which has to be what, 90% of the Windows users out here, so they don't bother in looking any further and think they are safe. Is that telemetry or tell-on-me? smirk Thanks all. smashpc


"Don't Hate Me Because I Am Beautiful...There Are Many Other Reasons!"
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092318
12/09/16 03:52 PM
12/09/16 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted By: GreyFuss
Oh Crimeny, now I am even more confused but in some way I think thats what they want. Just confuse the masses that don't know much about this, which has to be what, 90% of the Windows users out here, so they don't bother in looking any further and think they are safe.

I agree with you, but I think most Windows users just give up trying to understand, and assume they're doomed to give up more information about themselves than they have to. Microsoft will continue to sell the information -- supposedly anonymized and aggregated.
But it's been proven that de-anonymization techniques work
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De-anonymization
and since the information is much more valuable when de-anonymized, there's no reason to believe the companies Microsoft shares the information with (sells it to) won't be de-anonymizing the information and storing it somewhere, not necessarily with much care taken to keep it secure from thieves. Even if you trust Microsoft to keep the information secure, do you trust the unnamed companies Microsoft is "sharing" information with?

Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092326
12/09/16 09:20 PM
12/09/16 09:20 PM
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They sure make it hard to know that you need and what you don't!


Would that I could be the peacemaker in your soul that I might turn the discord and the rivalry of your elements into oneness and melody
Gibran
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1092333
12/10/16 12:06 AM
12/10/16 12:06 AM
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And I agree with Jenny... Who knows...


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Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: Draclvr] #1092340
12/10/16 06:59 AM
12/10/16 06:59 AM
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Mad Offline
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I have to agree, too, and now my premature elation has definitely died a death !!!! rolleyes12


Time : The Most Precious Commodity
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1093164
12/18/16 03:49 AM
12/18/16 03:49 AM
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Have you seen the update at the Forbes site? Not as simple as originally presented.

15 December Update - bad news everyone. Microsoft has been in contact to say Scott's blog was ambiguously worded and only "enterprise customers managing updates via Windows Server Update Services or Configuration Manager can now selectively install Security Only updates at any time". Consumers will still receive everything in a lump ("Rollup") which is very disappointing. Microsoft confirmed that Scott has edited now his post to remove the ambiguity.

Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: Pokey] #1093182
12/18/16 09:57 AM
12/18/16 09:57 AM
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"only "enterprise customers managing updates via Windows Server Update Services or Configuration Manager can now selectively install Security Only updates at any time"."

My Win7 is the "Enterprise" version so I presume I can relate to that ??


Time : The Most Precious Commodity
Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: GreyFuss] #1093206
12/18/16 12:22 PM
12/18/16 12:22 PM
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Jenny100 Offline
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Windows Server Update Services (WSUS) and System Center Configuration Manager (SCCM) are tools for managing a network of business computers. Instead of connecting to Windows Update, the company computers would receive updates through a server the company IT has set up and configured for what updates they wanted distributed to company computers. This effectively filters out updates that aren't wanted because the computers never connect to Microsoft's update servers directly.

WSUS and Configuration Manager aren't something a home user would be using to select updates or configuring Windows Update. Mad, it's possible that your tech could set something up for you that would filter unwanted updates, but WSUS and SCCM aren't automatically built into Windows 7 Enterprise.

This github article from October 2016 has more info
http://www.ghacks.net/2016/10/10/say-good-bye-to-individual-patches-on-windows-7-and-8/

Re: Microsoft Confirms Massive Windows 7, Windows 8 Upgrade Changes [Re: Jenny100] #1093216
12/18/16 01:07 PM
12/18/16 01:07 PM
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Sorry about that, Jenny100, and thank you, but you know what a novice I am with techie stuff blush
My very simple techie philosophy is "if it ain't broke don't fix it" !! And if it IS "broke" .... phone one's Son in Law rotfl12


Time : The Most Precious Commodity
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