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Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) #1157391
07/20/18 08:19 AM
07/20/18 08:19 AM
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mike_bn Offline OP
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Hello fellow gamers,

once a year, a very good friend of mine comes for a visit and we play adventures games three days in a row, pretty much the whole day, starting after breakfast until deep into the night. We call it our yearly mega-session ;-)

So in advance, we plan what we are going to play. As we are quite experienced gamers and quite good at puzzle-solving, we usually are able to finish at least one big game and start or solve a shorter one.

Usually the big game is a myst-clone and the other one something else (for example: Quern + Nancy Drew 1).

And here comes our problem: we are not sure whether we found a great myst game to play yet.
And of course we would love to play a highlight.

Our current list of potential candidates are:

- xing, land beyond (first impression is quite good, currently favorite to play, but still not sure)
- roonsehv (too short?)
- haven moon (quite short? too easy?)
- catyph (maybe not because an improved version ‚catyph light‘ was announced)

So my question is: which one of those did you like a best or can you recommend a myst-game that you think is really, really great and is not one of those we already played - see the following list (a few listed are probably not real myst clones)
We already played:

- Myst 1-5
- Rhem I-IV
- Schizm 1-2
- Obsidian
- Obduction
- Quern
- Timelapse
- Shivers 1
- ASA
- Aura 1,2
- The Witness
- Zork: Nemesis
- Lighthouse
- Amerzone
- Isles of Derek
- Reah
- 9: Last Resort
- 7th Guest
- Black Dahlia
- Riddle of the Sphinx
- Morpheus
- Alida
- Shine
- Rama
- Isles of Derek


Other Myst-Games (according to some very interesting forum thread) we know nothing about
And are potential candidates if someone recommends them:

1953: KGB Unleashed
Adam Syndrome
Ages of Ilathid
Aporia: Uncover the Mystery
Aztec
Beyond Atlantis 2
Beyond Worlds
Bioscopia
Biosys
Blackstone Chronicles
Byzantine: the Betrayal
Celopatray: A Queens Destiny
Celtica
Chemicus
Coma: A Mind Adventure
Comer
Crytsal Key 1und 2
Cydonia -- Mars: The First Manned Mission/Lightbringer
Darkstar: Interactive Movie
Darkstart (not Darkstar One)
Death Gate
Destination: Treasure Island
Dream (HyperSloth Games)
Dust: A Tale of the Wired West
Eastern Mind, the lost souls of Tongue Nou
Echo: Secrets of the lost cavern
Egypt 1156 B.C.: Tomb of the Pharaoh
Everybody's Gone to the Rapture
FullPipe
Gadget: Past as Future
Iron Helix
Jerusalem the three roads to the holy land
L-Zone
Laurie Anderson's Puppet Motel
Light of Darkness
Lost in Time
LSDs
Majestic: Alien Encounter, Symbiocom/Syn-Factor, ZeroCritical
Mathica
Messenger
Miasmata
Mission Critical
Mistmare
Montas
Mystery of the Nautlius (Iphone-Version stabiler als PC)

Nostradamus the last prophecy
Opsys
Outcry (Sublustrum)
Pathologic
Physicus
Post Mortem
Prominence
Puppet Motel
Qin: Tomb of the Middle Kingdom
Realms of Illusion
Realms of the Haunting
Reset
Ring: Legend of the Nibelungen
Routine
Salammbo

Sentient (Psygnosis)
Sentinel: Descendants in Time/Realms of Illusion
Shannara
Slip Space: The Burma-Shave Analogy
Starship Titanic
Thanaphobia
The Filmmaker
The Five Cores
The Oracle
The Sacred Mirror of Kofun
Timescape Journey to Pompeii
Titanic: Adventure Out of Time
Total Distortion
Traitor's Gate
Versailles 1685
Ween: The Prophecy
Zelenhgorm

The Cassandra Galleries
Connections: It's a Mind Game
Drowned God
Echo: Secrets of the Lost Cavern
Lunar Deep
Secrets of the Luxor


Last edited by mike_bn; 07/24/18 01:18 AM.
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157404
07/20/18 10:52 AM
07/20/18 10:52 AM
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Roon Sehv may not be a long game, but it is well worth playing. There is also a Roon Sehv 2. The game developer is also working on a full game called RealMYHA, but it hasn't been released yet.

Xing is an excellent choice and will keep you busy for quite a while! Doesn't hurt that it's pretty too.


Pulling weeds in the flower beds!
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157410
07/20/18 12:41 PM
07/20/18 12:41 PM
Joined: Feb 2001
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In case you haven't played these, give them a try:

Ghost of a Tale (long)
The Pillars of the Earth (fairly long)
The Book of Unwritten Tales (and "2" release)
New & Tasty! Oddworld: Abe's Oddysee (long)

and "Gorogoa" if you like puzzle games this is a very good one.

All the ones I mentioned are on GOG.

Robert


"Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened."

-Dr. Seuss
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157432
07/20/18 02:39 PM
07/20/18 02:39 PM
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My vote would be Sentinel: Descendants in Time but you need the disc and a computer running Windows XP.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157434
07/20/18 02:46 PM
07/20/18 02:46 PM
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southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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Originally Posted By: mike_bn
- xing, land beyond (first impression is quite good, currently favorite to play, but still not sure)
- roonsehv (too short?)
- haven moon (quite short? too easy?)
- catyph (maybe not because an improved version ‚ catyph light‘ was announced)

Check the description of the "Light" version of Catyph by the developer
https://adventuregamers.com/forums/viewthread/10772
It's up to you whether you think everything listed is an improvement.
The link to the demo on that webpage still seems to work.

"Myst-like" seems to mean different things to different people.
Some think "anything 1st person"
Some think "anything with puzzles of any sort"
So I don't really know what you're looking for except by the games you've listed as played.

Do you have access to an old computer with Windows 95 or 98?
Some games, like Cydonia/Lightbringer or Connections, would be hard to get running properly (without excessive crashes, freezes, etc.) on a modern computer.

You don't mention Barrow Hill, Barrow Hill: The Dark Path, Dark Fall: The Journal, Dark Fall: Lights Out, or Scratches. These are 1st person point-and-click adventure games. Are you trying to avoid "horror" games? I didn't like Dark Fall: Lost Souls because it was too over-the-top (throbbing pink intestines in the sink), but I thought the previous Dark Fall games were good.

If you liked Schizm 2 you'll probably like Sentinel: Descendents in Time (aka Realms of Illusion). Don't buy both Realms of Illusion and Sentinel thinking they are different games -- it's Dreamcatcher up to their old reselling-the-same-game-under-a-different-name tricks.

Lightbringer had a DVD version. The CD version and DVD version both had patches, but the patches were different. Both patches seem to be available in the patches-scrolls archive ***here***
However I don't think this game will work well unless you have an older computer. The patches are from the days of Windows 95/98 when the game was released.

You don't mention Shivers 2. Playing Shivers 2 immediately after playing Shivers 1 (19 years ago) made Shivers 2 look bad. But replaying Shivers 2 more recently I liked it much more because I was comparing it to recent games instead of to Shivers 1.

Shannara, Death Gate, and Mission Critical are by Legend Entertainment and would work in DOSBox. They are good games, though not much like Myst IMO. I think of Myst as having mechanical puzzles that often have to be solved by experimenting, limited character interaction or none at all, exploration of the environment important for puzzle solving, point-and-click, and of course 1st person and you play as an ***AFGNCAAP*** ("Ageless, Faceless, Gender-Neutral, Culturally Ambiguous Adventure Person"). The puzzles in Shannara, Death Gate, and Mission Critical don't fit that description. Speaking of which, is there a reason Zork: Grand Inquisitor is not on your list?

And in case you weren't aware, with many 1st person games from companies like Cryo, Kheops, or Microids, there are "updated" versions that have removed most of the puzzles and also removed interactive hotspots and nodes where you can move to. If something in the old version was causing an issue in Mac OSX or mobile, they didn't fix it -- they chopped it out. So you end up with many of the best parts of the game being removed. They also thought it was perfectly all right to substitute 8 or 9 low resolution screens with 3 high resolution screens, limiting where you could go and what you could look at. Last time I downloaded the Windows version of Beyond Atlantis from GOG, it was the full original version and worked in Windows 7 and 8.1 after tweaking. However the Mac OSX version at GOG was the eviscerated version that had removed most of the puzzles and other interactive bits. I've read that the Windows version that Steam sells is the eviscerated version. You have to be very careful what version you buy if it's "updated", especialy if it's a 1st person game originally from Cryo, Kheops, or Microids Canada. For some reason the company that bought out Microids IP and is now known as Microids treated their 3rd person games much better than their 1st person games. An "updated" Syberia will be the full game while an "updated" Road to India will be about 1/3 of the original.

Anyway, assuming you have an old computer available in case the games don't run acceptably on a new one, here are some of the games I remember enjoying (mostly from your 2nd list):
  • Atlantis 3/Beyond Atlantis 2 (non-expurgated version)
  • Atlantis 2/Beyond Atlantis (non-expurgated version)
  • Byzantine: The Betrayal (might need old Win95/98 computer)
  • Cydonia/Lightbringer (might need old Win95/98 computer)
  • Celtica (might need old Win 95/98 computer) -- though I got Celtica working in a Virtual Machine, I never got it where it wouldn't crash repeatedly at a certain point in the game, making it impossible to proceed without a save from an older computer
  • Death Gate
  • Echo: Secrets of the Lost Cavern
  • Jerusalem
  • Pompeii/Timescape (if you plan to play Jerusalem)
  • Lost in Time
  • Mission Critical
  • Outcry
  • Sentinel:Descendants in Time/Realms of Illusion
  • Ring ("stiff" gameplay but interesting design)
  • Shannara
  • Connections
  • Drowned God (if you want something bizarre and unique)
  • Versailles 1685 (if you like historical games)
  • Physicus (if you enjoy edutainment with an in-game encyclopedia)
  • Bioscopia (if you enjoy edutainment with an in-game encyclopedia)
  • Chemicus (if you enjoy edutainment with an in-game encyclopedia)
  • Journeyman Project: Pegasus Prime
  • Journeyman Project 2: Buried in Time
  • Journeyman Project 3: Legacy of Time
  • Faust: 7 Games of the Soul

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Jenny100] #1157436
07/20/18 02:54 PM
07/20/18 02:54 PM
Joined: Nov 2000
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United Kingdom
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Some really good recommendations there, Jenny100 !! thumbsup


Time : The Most Precious Commodity
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157437
07/20/18 03:01 PM
07/20/18 03:01 PM
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mike_bn Offline OP
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Thank you so much to everyone who responded so far smile
I will definitely read every post again once my headaches and sore throat are gone.

A special thank you to Jenny - that was a long post with lots
of valuable information. Will read that one again and respond then in detail.

For now, just one thing: To be able to play almost every adventure game,
i own several NB's from basically each 'Windows Age', so i have the OS Mac, Win10, Win7,
Winxp and even Win98 available. And of course Dosbox. So i think there
are not many games i won't be able to play. The only problem could
be old Dos-Games where i am not able to configure DosBox properly.

So i don't mind how old a game is you recommend to me. Age doesn't matter.
There are brilliant old games, just like there are great modern games.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157439
07/20/18 03:22 PM
07/20/18 03:22 PM
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I surely can recommend Xing, The Land Beyond. It looks great and has increasing difficult puzzles, it is a long game.
The House of Da Vinci is also a very good game with lots of puzzles.
The Room I and II, that are pure puzzle games

You have played Myst I - V but have you played URU, ages beyond Myst, complete chronicles?

The Eyes of Ara is very good game, long game.
RoonSehv and Haven Moon are very good games, not very long games but very good.

I have played Catyph, the original game and I found it a very good game. I played it on Steam maybe they have the original game, not the light version.

Lion_1251 thumbsup thumbsup

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157453
07/20/18 07:49 PM
07/20/18 07:49 PM
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Most likely, since your a Myst fan, you've probably just missed to list URU among your played games. But if you haven't played it, that's the one to go with.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157463
07/20/18 10:22 PM
07/20/18 10:22 PM
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You may be interested in Odyssey: The Story of Science which was an under the radar Myst clone that I liked very much. Released just over a year ago. https://store.steampowered.com/app/558110/Odyssey__The_Story_of_Science/


"Don't Hate Me Because I Am Beautiful...There Are Many Other Reasons!"
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157520
07/21/18 05:04 PM
07/21/18 05:04 PM
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mike_bn Offline OP
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I am still sick, so this post won't be long, but i wanted to at least say
thank you again for everybody who responded.


We will most likely try xing, but i will note every recommendation we
got, there were a few i did not now at all (Odyssey, Eyes of Ara..)
and Jennys list was also cool.

So, thanks again.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157522
07/21/18 05:15 PM
07/21/18 05:15 PM
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mike_bn Offline OP
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One more thing, probably Jenny or someone else knows:

I watched a clip from Sentinel, and it reminded me very much of Schizm.
With Schizm, there was a big difference between the CD and DVD version.
So my first question is: does the same apply for Sentinel? I can only find
the cd version on ebay - can i buy it or is there a better DVD version?

Second question is whether Sentinel and Realms are 100% identical?
The worst thing would be if one had less puzzles or easier versions of the puzzles than
the other. Which one would you buy?


Last edited by mike_bn; 07/21/18 05:16 PM.
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157523
07/21/18 05:33 PM
07/21/18 05:33 PM
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southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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Originally Posted By: mike_bn
One more thing, probably Jenny or someone else knows:

I watched a clip from Sentinel, and it reminded me very much of Schizm.
With Schizm, there was a big difference between the CD and DVD version.
So my first question is: does the same apply for Sentinel? I can only find
the cd version on ebay - can i buy it or is there a better DVD version?

There is no DVD version of Schizm 2 or Sentinel.
Schizm 2 and Sentinel were 3D games, which at the time of release took up a lot less disc space.
The first Schizm was prerendered, and the CD version used smaller, lower resolution graphics than the DVD version.

Originally Posted By: mike_bn
Second question is whether Sentinel and Realms are 100% identical?

Exactly the same except for the name and the different box.
Possibly they changed the name of the installation folder but the game itself is the same.

Quote:
The worst thing would be if one had less puzzles or easier versions of the puzzles than
the other. Which one would you buy?

Which game box do you think is prettier?

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Jenny100] #1157540
07/21/18 09:48 PM
07/21/18 09:48 PM
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Jenny, thanks for that clear reminder about some of our old favorites possibly not running well on newer machines, or being tampered with so that they will run but the game is diminished. I'm sad to hear that. I'm nostalgic for all the old games on the lists posted above in this thread. Played most of them and loved every experience! But the buyer has to remain wary and verify a few things before going back there.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157728
07/24/18 02:10 AM
07/24/18 02:10 AM
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mike_bn Offline OP
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@Jenny: I took a closer look at your list and marked those games you recommended in my list - thanks.
Not in my list were only Faust and Ring, if i did not miss anything.
Could you please give me a link to the game 'Ring'?
I am not sure which game you mean.

Barrow Hill, Barrow Hill: The Dark Path, Dark Fall: The Journal, Dark Fall: Lights Out, or Scratches
-> we played all of them except for Barrow Hill 2. Its on our list, though.
I did not list them because i cannot list all games we played and they don't feel like
myst-clones to me. They were good games we enjoyed, though.

Thanks a again for the information about the diminished re-releases. That was very valuable information!!!

I just bought Sentinel and we will either play Xing or Sentinel during our Mega-Session
as the long game. After we finished one of these, we will start playing Antichamber
(probably not a classical myst-clone, not sure about that yet),
which looks really interesting (i played it for 10 minutes and it felt really special).
Also we will take a look into Stanley Parable (not a myst-clone).

And yes, i don't think its possible to give an exact defintion of a Myst-Like game
everybody would agree with. We divided games in
the following sub-genres:

Myst-Clone (Schizm, Rhem, Aura)
Story-Driven (Lost Crown, Longest Journey, Dreamfall, LIS, we also put Dark Fall here, and yes thats arguable)
Point-Click (Manica Mansion, Feeble Files, Monkey Island, Book of Unwritten Tales)
Puzzle (Stephens Sausage Roll, Safe Cracker, 7ths guest)
Hybrid (everything else which has at least some kind of adventure or puzzle vibe,
of the games we played we only have Portal in that list. Portal was actually the reason
for this new category, because we could not put it in one of the other categories, it did not fit in any)


Thanks again to everybody for your help!

Friday 23:00=11pm (german time) until Monday deep into the night we will be playing
pretty much all the time - If you are interested, i will post how it was after that ;-)



Edit: Lol, i wrote 'Book of Unwritten Tails' at first ;-)







Last edited by mike_bn; 07/24/18 02:26 AM.
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157738
07/24/18 08:58 AM
07/24/18 08:58 AM
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mike_bn Offline OP
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@Jenny (or anyone who knows):

Could you please help me one more time?
Of the games i listed, especially the ones you recommended,
could you tell me which are the ones
that also exist as a diminished/changed version?
You mentioned Beyond Atlantis, but are there other ones that
you can think of from the top of your head?

Btw, you asked about Zork: Grand Inquisitor. We already
bought it, i forgot to list it as one of the potential candidates.
Now that we decided to play Xing or Sentinel, we will play Zork
later sometime. I bought it on GoG for Windows, hope its a full version wink


Last edited by mike_bn; 07/24/18 09:00 AM.
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157761
07/24/18 11:55 AM
07/24/18 11:55 AM
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I'm interested!


Pulling weeds in the flower beds!
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Draclvr] #1157765
07/24/18 12:29 PM
07/24/18 12:29 PM
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Marian Offline
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The Atlantis games on GOG for the PC are the full versions, as well as Zork: Grand Inquisitor.

Last edited by Marian; 07/24/18 03:30 PM. Reason: edited for accuracy
Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157771
07/24/18 03:19 PM
07/24/18 03:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 39,632
southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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The Windows versions of the Beyond Atlantis games on GOG are the full versions.

The Mac OS X versions of the Beyond Atlantis games on GOG are stripped down mobile ports.

All 1st person games from Kheops, Cryo, and Microids published by GOG and elsewhere are stripped down mobile ports. I have played (or started playing) nearly all Mac OS X versions of 1st person games from Kheops, Cryo, and Microids offered at GOG, and without exception they have been the eviscerated mobile ports. That includes Amerzone, the Egypt games, etc.

If you have Mac OS X, download the Windows version and play it in a Virtual Machine with Windows installed inside the VM -- or in Boot Camp.

The CD version of Atlantis 2/Beyond Atlantis that was for Mac OS 8.6-9.1 (and published by Dreamcatcher in 2001) is a full version, but unless you have an old PowerMac capable of running Mac OS 8.6-9.1 I wouldn't recommend this version.

Any game from GOG that uses ScummVM will be the full version.
https://www.scummvm.org/compatibility/2.0.0/
That includes Myst, Riven, the Zork games, Pegasus Prime, Shivers, etc.

Any game that plays in DOSBox will be the full version.
Many GOG games use DOSBox or ScummVM.

Originally Posted By: mike_bn
could you tell me which are the ones
that also exist as a diminished/changed version?

Here is a list of games developed by Kheops Studio
http://www.mobygames.com/company/kheops-studio
All games listed there with the exception of the two earliest ones (Egypt II and Crystal Key II) have mobile ports. Some are worse than others and some download websites may offer the original versions.

GOG seems to sell the original versions of Windows games. They may have tweaked them slightly (they certainly had to remove disc checks), but the entire game is there. GOG does not sell many 1st person games from Kheops, Cryo, and Microids beyond the Atlantis games and Amerzone.

Steam often seems to sell the eviscerated mobile ports, going by user reviews.
Check the user reviews for a particular game to find out for sure. Some people who buy the Steam version have previously played the CD version of the game and know when features are missing. Unfortunately some users never played the original versions and don't know what they're missing, so look over the reviews carefully.

Big Fish has been known to sell eviscerated versions -- as with Nautilus. It's not Big Fish's fault -- it's the fault of the company that supplied them with the game. But Big Fish's version of Safecracker may be a full release, so it varies. Check user reviews.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Jenny100] #1157772
07/24/18 03:32 PM
07/24/18 03:32 PM
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near Yosemite in California
Marian Offline
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Jenny, I have Lost Eden for the PC from Cryo, it is first person, and it is not a stripped-down version. Likewise with Dragon Lore.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157773
07/24/18 03:35 PM
07/24/18 03:35 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,243
Chicago
oldbroad Offline
BAAG Specialist
oldbroad  Offline
BAAG Specialist

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,243
Chicago
I haven't played Xing yet but just finished replaying Sentinel and very much enjoyed it!

I hope you and your friend have a great time, whichever game you play. I'll be interested in hearing about it.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Marian] #1157775
07/24/18 03:59 PM
07/24/18 03:59 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 39,632
southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Jenny100  Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Sonic Boomer

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 39,632
southeast USA
Originally Posted By: Marian
Jenny, I have Lost Eden for the PC from Cryo, it is first person, and it is not a stripped-down version. Likewise with Dragon Lore.

Both are DOS games, and last time I checked GOG used DOSBox to run them.
Originally Posted By: Jenny100
Any game that plays in DOSBox will be the full version.
Many GOG games use DOSBox or ScummVM.

It's way easier for GOG to configure game files to run with DOSBox or ScummVM as opposed to remaking the whole game -- especially ScummVM, which replaces the original game exe with its own scummvm.exe and then makes use of the original game files to run the game.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Jenny100] #1157779
07/24/18 04:12 PM
07/24/18 04:12 PM
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 36,355
near Yosemite in California
Marian Offline
Global Moderator
Marian  Offline
Global Moderator
Sonic Boomer

Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 36,355
near Yosemite in California
Sorry, Jenny - I wasn't reading carefully enough. You are almost never mistaken about such things. smile

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: Marian] #1157782
07/24/18 04:20 PM
07/24/18 04:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 39,632
southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Jenny100  Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
Sonic Boomer

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 39,632
southeast USA
Originally Posted By: Marian
Sorry, Jenny - I wasn't reading carefully enough. You are almost never mistaken about such things. smile

I'm sure I am sometimes mistaken, and I apologize if I don't always write clearly enough to be understood.

Re: Please help us find a really great Myst-Clone :-) [Re: mike_bn] #1157784
07/24/18 05:11 PM
07/24/18 05:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,243
Chicago
oldbroad Offline
BAAG Specialist
oldbroad  Offline
BAAG Specialist

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,243
Chicago
Jenny, you write so clearly that even I usually understand what you're writing.

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