Playing Of Light and Darkness

I'm partway through the tutorial. The game is so different, I don't quite know what to make of it, but I'm liking it a lot. I suppose it could get repetitive, but right now I'm spending time with my jaw dropping open (mostly from surprise).

I just made it into the theater. Perfect setting for that particular sin. (Apologies to all actors.)

I like the matching aspect of the game. So far it's pretty logical. I don't know if I'll need a map -- I think I'd like to create one for myself (unless the map gives you hints to new locations?).

The graphics are great. The music is unexpected, but it fits.

Inventory is a little strange, but I'm figuring it out. The one thing so far I could do without -- the "ding ding ding" chime. Does that go away when you leave the tutorial?

Rick -- I'm very sorry, but I can't move a post. I can only move an entire thread, not a post within a thread.

Would you mind copy-and-pasting the post here?

Thanks!

Annie -- oh dear. And that particular game box is so...memorable. Is the game likely to still be in the box, or are you looking for the jewel case? The game comes on 3 CDs, so it's one of those multiple jewel case thingies.

If the game is still in the box and you happen to live with a brother, you might want to poke around in HIS closet.

On second thought, bad suggestion.

Settled Boomer
Member # 1010

posted 08-02-2004 04:54 PM
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Becky,
No problem. New thread for OLAD. I am going to read more today on the history of apparitions and stuff. The game village reminds me of a county fair at night, save the rides, lots of neon lights and cool places to check out. I have filled in more on the old sketch pad sheet, just added lots more stuff in pen. Apparition, Artifact and sin/rooms committed. Some rooms have some hidden rooms also. So far I am not bored, lots of great graphics on XP. I am now lost under the village and having fun.
Melanie and Glynn,
I trust that the rope does not have a loop and a knot in it.

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Best Wishes Always,
Rick

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Here are my guesses, based solely on reading the manual:

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I know Mani is Pride from the tutorial.

Quechua -- Pride
Raj -- Sloth
Koobooragong -- Anger
Wa-No-Te -- Lust
Amratus I -- Pride
Heung Po-Chi -- Pride
Shaamra -- Envy
Xuanchiquel -- Gluttony
Cain -- Envy
Shakem -- Greed (Avarice)
Tirinia -- Lust
Osira -- Anger
Admah -- Lust
Man of No Name -- Greed
Tiplotezca -- Anger
Zanazca -- Envy
Saman -- VERY difficult. A touch of Envy?
Droessus -- Greed
Piankhy -- Sloth
Serguis -- Gluttony
Alexanader -- Pride
Caligula -- Anger
Anka -- Lust
Ivan -- Anger
Marie -- Greed
Aleister -- Pride
Admar -- Also difficult. Enjoying the pain of others -- would that be Anger?
Alfred -- Pride
Carlos -- Anger
John -- Lust
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@We'll see if I got at all close by game's end.

I thought that I got it. I read through the part on the apparitions and the next chapter is called," Those Responsible". Open it up to the credits for the game.
I cannot pin down the Dark Lord's stuff. I think that these are the really,really bad guys. They may have all the sins in combo. So I will just comment on the normal bad guy, apparitions. The game play in the book says, " These are the Dark Lord's apparitions", the normal bad guys, not labled, Dark Lord's. Mani we saw, yes and Shaamra,Tirinia and Anka's stuff was spelled out for us. I did note that Raj was lazy and resented his neighbors wealth and took it. It was not his wife's nagging that drove him into a life of crime. Nagging is not a Sin. Envey is though.
I read about AL Krupp a few times and can only say that he is a very Greedy business man with no heart. Now on to the game for answers.

Annie -- Woo hoo!!! "When in doubt, excavate the garage" happens to be a motto of mine. NOT. I've been avoiding having to figure out what junk is stored in my garage for years.

I'm thrilled you found the game.

BTW -- have you ever played Odyssey: Search for Ulysses? Now THERE was a pigsty.

Rick -- yeah, the manual has parts that are pretty clever. So far Droessus is my favorite apparition from the manual. I think of him as the "Yankee Trader" apparition. His chief sin was that he was born in the wrong century.
Well of COURSE he did. What's wrong with that?

There are even worse bad guys? Bad guys that make Caligula look like a mere file clerk in the Department of Evil?

Annie and Becky, I could not pin down him a few others not named as Dark Lords.

I found the booklet, in my husband's computer room. Now I'm collecting artifacts and I'm off to find out how to redeem these characters. Guess I should read the booklet too.

Hey Annie -- yes, I think it's worth taking the time to read the booklet/manual. It gives some backstory and also describes the apparitions.

I think it's curious that the actor who plays "Brother War" in the game is named Victor Love. Could this be a joke?

I'm becoming interested as to whether all the apparitions were historical figures. Some of them seem too horrible to be real.

BTW Annie -- if you do the free tour, you'll get a tutorial on how to play the game. It's VERY helpful.

I'm really not much ahead of you. Though it looks as though Rick is way ahead of the both of us.

Rick -- have you found any quirkiness about the save game feature? (Limited number of slots, or inability to save except at certain points, for instance?) It strikes me that unlimited saves would make this game easier to play.

Afternoon,
I have been only playing around in the village.
I did find that the pause button works to stop the timer, take notes and set up your next move.
The game play has an customized level and will check this out, also. I hope to go to the Mask room tonight and put the colored Orbs with the apparitions on my chicken scratch sketch pad.
This weekend I will really dive in and try play for real. If I have all things needed, apparition, artifact, color Orb and sin/sin room then I can give it a shot.

Rick -- thanks for the hint about the Pause button. Makes a big difference.

I've learned everything I can from the tutorial, and now I'm playing the real game. I've been taking notes like mad too.

I opened up the box again and found what must be the map. It is VERY helpful, partly because you can see the transportal symbols more clearly.

At some point we should all compare notes to see if the game randomly generates the orb and transportal locations and/or apparition colors. If they are randomly generated, it will be very hard to write a walkthrough (which would explain why there aren't a lot of them out there). So far I would say they are NOT random, (at least the transportals aren't) because I'm finding them at the same places when I start a new game. And the artifacts would have to remain the same. The orbs are another matter....

Any guess as to what the tall statue with a flame is holding in her other hand?

Every time I go into the Hall of Anger I have to turn the sound down or my family looks at me VERY strangely.

I still don't have much of a clue as to what the video sequences are about. The game has a plot mystery going too, I think.

Angel's face is beautifully animated, isn't it? I guess when you're that good to look at, who cares whether your conversation makes any sense? I saw the camera wheel around her once -- is she looking in a mirror during these sequences?

I got a good laugh out of the "game over" sequence with the trial. I suspect Gar Hob's quip is ad-libbed. Anyway, what he says sounds more like something James Woods would say, rather than something the Dark Lord of the Seventh Millenium would say.

The video with the kids at the end, though, is probably in First Place for the "Silliest Thing I've Seen in a Computer Game" contest.

Becky and Rick:

I'm back. I had to take yesterday off from gaming to pay some attention to my husband. I hate how work and life interfere with gaming!

Becky: I did find the free tour and found it very useful. It helped me redeem my first soul. I can't find the map, though, and I'm dreading another hunt through the pig sty and the garage to find it. Maybe I'll try and get through without it. Don't suppose it's anywhere on the web? Maybe I should take a look.

I think the orbs may be random. I've had to replay a few times and I don't think they are always in the same places.

My weekend plans: read the manual; try out color combinations (in the free tour area); use my stop watch to time the color flashes (I assume these mark passing time) and intervals between the one minute warnings; go to the star room and try and figure out who gets what colors. My husband is working this weekend, so I'm planning pure game indulgence. I'll check back later and see how you are doing. I'm off......

Ooooeee, rock and roll! I've managed to redeem one more of these guys. But although I have a bunch more items, I haven't been able to redeem any more.

And, Becky, I guess you're right, the orbs are always in the same places.

Well, back to it.

WEll, I've officially passed into the addicted stage with this game. On the back of the map are pictures of all the artifacts. I've had a great time matching them to the apparitions based on the descriptions in the manual. I was mystified by the artifacts at first (what evil could be perpetrated using an electric guitar or a placemat)? I may be over-reaching, but the artifacts sometimes represent the apparition's attitude, or they represent a possession that should have been used for good, but was wasted or neglected. Anyway, I'll see how good a matcher I've been as the game progresses.

Annie -- the map is helpful, but (so far) not neccessary. I haven't heard of it being on the web.

I still haven't figured out the color flashes either -- though I'm sure you're right, they have something to do with time. I think they are in some way connected to the apparitions of that particular color, but I'm not sure how. After yellow flashes, for instance, and before red flashes -- do you have to redeem the "yellow" apparitions within that time period, or else they can't be redeemed? Or do you have to pick up the artifacts that match the "yellow" apparitions within the time period, but can redeem them at any time? Or it could be something else entirely. I'm still experimenting with it.

Since the picture of the artifacts DID come with the game, I'm enclosing a description for you here -- I'll put it in as a spoiler so you don't have to refer to it if you don't want to:

Spoiler
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3 skulls, each with different-colored eyes
A religious symbol, vaguely cross-like
A rubber stamp (I think)
A spiral shell
A red exotic flower
An oyster shell
A purse
An abacus
A sheep
A knife -- it may be a surgical knife
A cigar
A branding iron (I think)
A flag with a skull and crossbones
A spoon
A heart
A piece of cloth. May be a placemat, may just be cloth
A noose
A Ying/yang symbol
A carved horses's head
A mirror with lipstick on it (I think)
A wreath (possibly to be worn on the head)
A knife, wooden handle
A squarish stone with a purple symbol on it
An electric guitar
A clown's face
A sword
A cannon (I thought this was a telescope for awhile)
EDIT!!! What I thought was a branding iron is apparently some kind of stone-carving tool. What I thought was a rubber stamp is apparently some kind of ancient writing device.
EDIT2!!!!Well, scratch the above stone-carving tool. I blew it. It IS a branding iron. Also, what I thought was a spiral shell is a actually a special stone.

YOu may notice that there are more apparitions than there are artifacts
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I'm going to be leaving tomorrow for a short trip to celebrate my 25th wedding anniversary! I'll be loading this game on my laptop and hope to play it while on vacation. I'm not sure I'll be able to get online, but I'll try.

Ok, I have been with my pre-computer unit for a few decades. I have been into computer stuff, since we needed punch cards to input.
Somehow, after five great kids, I get to play agin, (on the computer).
Anyhow, Annie did you find the Map room? I can not redeem anything until I have the color match.
I will try and hunt agin. <img border="0" alt="" title="" src="graemlins/cry.gif" />

Rick:

There's a map room?!! I may have found it, but not recognized it as such. I redeemed everyone in the first level, so now I'm trying to get comfortable in the second. Everything is moving faster. Where are you?

Morning Annie,
I could not find a map room. I may have mis-read an old thread. I did find find the mask room and put down the colors that match the apparitions. Now along with the matching artifact, I went to a sin room and waited. Bad move, I finally figured that no one was coming and went to another sin room. There was the apparition that I needed to redeem and redeem I did. Well this plan has clock issues big time. After doing this for a bit, while waiting in a sin room, I just thought heck, I'll just do it. Big suprise, it worked.

Notes:
I think the light/color flashes are what in the book are called star flashes and the color matches the apparition that is now out and about in the village. The mask room is a must. You really need the information here first or you would just be guessing as to what color(s) goes with what apparition.
The book also tells of forced to appear apparitions. Instead of waiting for them to come into the village. Click the appropriate star on the clock and those three will enter the village now. I once ran out of time, because the next group was not there yet. There was no one to flash with white light. I think this may be handy in level 2&3. The portals are very important when you are blocked by apparitions. Hint:
You must find the secret rooms for lust and anger. Pride is not a secret room. The saves are ok to use pretty much anywhere anytime. I had to overwrite on a few to save slots. This may be an issue for anyone needing a saved game sent to them. I only have 3 for level 1. I found that the best time to save is after you redeem an apparition, load up on orbs and then save. Your good to go if the clock ticks down. I found orbs and portals in the same places. I made a habit to run through two next door places and restock very quickly. Hint: these two places are at the end of a street and have an inter connecting doorway. I will post notes from time to time. They are really just from reading the book, looking at the little map and making sence of it all.

Great notes, Rich. I'm beginning to think that a walkthrough would be very hard to write. What people need early in the game is "how to." After that it's mainly a matter of bagging all the souls, at least on the first two levels. Things may be different on three, where apparently the apparitions can punish you. I don't particularly want to be punished, thank you very much.

I have been only a little hampered by not having found the map. So far, after a few false starts on level one, I haven't run out of time. I've got six more souls to nab on level two. I've wasted a lot of time looking for a particular sin room on this level in which to finish them off. Finally dawned on me after a good night's sleep that this room doesn't exist, so I'm going back to assign these guys to the sins I have available.

There is one odd thing about the manual. The "bio" for one character, the rock singer, is blanked out. Elvis Presley is listed in the credits, but in the game he's called something else. Maybe the Presley estate didn't think this was funny. Anyway, lacking any information about him, I nailed him with a shrewd guess.

Happy Sunday gaming, Rich!

Arrrrg! It turned out there was another sin room, one that was devilishly hard to find. I'm now on level three.

Afternoon Annie,
Well with your detailed thoughts/hints and help for level 2, it should be a snap. Let's see, everything moves faster and there is a hard to find sin room. What a suprise this is. Oh, Ya and electric guitar guy, that is not even in my book. My book goes by a timeline of characters/apparitions and the only ones after 1940 are Alfred,Carlos and John. I see the picture of a guitar on my sketch pad. Is the guy named like, Billy Ray or Bobby Joe and his sin is Gluttony, from fryed peanut butter and bannana sandwiches.
And yes I do see Elvis/Joe Seely in the cast !!
I hope to try out level 2, for real as you don't really get to do a lot on the free tour.
Question:
How do you deal with the timer and do saves?

I have tabled the stop watch for the moment, as it requires a trip back to the pig sty to find the instructions for converting it from clock mode to timer mode (that's almost like a computer game!).

I spent rather a tedious time yesterday in level two. I accidently lost one of the artifacts and spent two hours trying to get it back, only to realize finally that I was looking for the wrong one! The end of level two was interesting. I made a false move and oops! was told I hadn't redeemed anyone and had failed! Thank heavens for saved games.

I'm going to put off playing until tomorrow. I find all those nasty spirits and the tension producing music are a little much at the moment. Also I'm anticipating trouble, big time, on level three, especially without the map. Maybe I should go back and make myself drawings of the trans-portals...

Are we having fun or what?

Hey all. I've been playing on my laptop while the PCU goes out for his daily run. I've also been following your progress, but didn't have time 'til now to post.

I'm also on Level Two. I just started it and am feeling my way around. I haven't been able to find the Hall of Avarice or the Hall of Sloth. Gonna go back and keep looking -- sounds like maybe it's a bit of a pixel hunt?

In the last level, there were three apparitions per sin. I'm assuming this holds true on level two as well.

I have tried to click on the star on the clock to advance to a specific star flash, but haven't been able to get it to work just by following the directions in the manual. If either of you figure out how to do it, please post!

Unless I get lucky (and I think that luck is a bit of a factor in this game) I'll be on Level Two for awhile. With the timed factor and the apparitions chasing you and the portals getting used up as you flee the apparitions and the artifacts only being available at specific times -- this game is challenging! Now they've added locked doors!

I've enjoyed the apparitions "statements" after they are freed. And Gar Hob's responses. I'm perplexed about Gar Hob. I'm not used to the idea of a Dark Lord possessing a sense of humor.

Annie -- I'm giving you a description of the map here after this spoiler warning. I'm choosing my own crazy interpretations of what the portal icons look like. It'll help until Rick's picture reaches you (I hope).

Spoiler
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Clock on the center of the village (clockface icon) -- no connecting rooms

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Hall of mirrors (simple mirror icon) -- no connecting rooms

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Studio MFer (jester icon) -- no connecting rooms

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Luna Crossing (moon icon) -- connects to The Temple

The Temple (columns icon) -- connects to the Luna Crossing and to the Earth Shifts

Earth Shifts (circle with pellets icon) -- connects to The Temple and to Hall of Avarice

Hall of Avarice (quartered pie icon) -- connects to Earth Shifts

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Poisoned Air (Shut-eyed smoke-blower icon) -- no connecting rooms

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Radiation (globe on frame icon) -- connects to Hall of Lust

Hall of Lust (fancy curlicue mirror icon) -- connects to Radiation

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El Dorado (four circles within a circle icon) -- next to, but not connected to the Hall of Pride -- El Dorado has no connecting rooms

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Hall of Pride (stage icon) - connects to Backstage

Backstage (simple arch hall icon) -- connects to the Hall of Pride, the Mask Room and Underground

Mask Room (winking mask) -- connects to Backstage

Underground (hat and wig icon) -- connects to Backstage and The Abyss

The Abyss (wings-heart-circle icon) -- connects to Underground

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Flood (teapot with square icon) -- connects with The Office and Passage of Time

The Office (desk icon) -- connects with Flood and Hall of Anger

Hall of Anger (square with gear, lower right) -- connects with The Office

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Flood (teapot with square icon) (an entire set of places connects here in the other direction) -- connects with Passage of Time and The Office

Passage of Time (fancy arch hall icon) -- connects with Flood, Plague, Hall of Envy, War

Plague (heart with handles icon)-- connects with Passage of Time and The Nightly News

The Nightly News (Eyewitness icon) -- connects with Plague

Hall of Envy (slicked hair-circle-dot icon)-- Connects with Passage of Time

War (radar icon) -- connects with Passage of Time and Hall of Accidie (sloth)

Hall of Accidie (Chinese balance icon) -- connects to War

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Famine (acorn smile icon) -- connects to Hall of Gluttony

Hall of Gluttony (water pump icon) -- connects to Famine
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Ahhh-- you must clear the apparitions before you can flash the clocdk!!! That makes sense. How'd you figure that out? The manual doesn't tell you!

We posted at about the same time -- if you look above you'll see my attempt at a description of the map.

Hey Rick -- could you proof my desciption of the map by looking at your map and making sure I didn't leave anything out? I don't want to make it harder to Annie (or anyone else who's playing without a map) by accidentally giving misleading information.

Hi Rick. Please cye. I really appreciate this!

Becky: Nice to hear from you again! Now quick, while your PCU is still out running, try this for changing the color on the clock. Start in the room whose artifacts you want to liberate. The owning apparitions must be present; flash them with white light. This will cause both the apparitions and the artifacts to disappear. Now go back to the clock and click on the color you want. When you return to the apocalyptic device room, the artifacts will be there and the apparitions will not.

There's no pixel hunt to find the Sloth room, as you will find out. But, heaven help us, finding the Avarice room!

Rick and Becky: Life on the third level is even more intense. After a few run ins with the Dark Lords, I left their objects alone, and they have left me alone. I suppose I'll have to face them eventually, but I'm sure I don't know how. <img border="0" alt="" title="" src="graemlins/cry.gif" /> Wish you were both up here with me!

Thanks Jenny!

Annie -- I found Sloth and Avarice! Yes, Avarice was difficult but fair, I think. Of course the only reason I found it was that I knew it was there because YOU had found it. I'm still enjoying the feeling of triumph.

I tried continuing the game after the apocalypse just to see what would happen. The locations of transportals and orbs stays the same, but you are wiped of all your inventory, and all the doors are relocked. The apparitions you freed stay freed, so if you need their artifact to open a door, you are out of luck in a big way.

Dagmar Hurt is the only apparition that floats around me but doesn't demand anything. I can even go THROUGH her out a door -- the others block me. I'm having trouble pinning down her sin.

I've found that if I go to a room with apparitions and flash with white light, the apparitions disappear and soon afterwards the clock flashes to the color of the room I'm in, so I can take the artifacts. This has happened twice, so it could be a conincidence. But it seems to eliminate the need to go to the clock and activate a star flash after white-lighting the apparitions of your choice.

I finally unlocked the door to Gluttony. Yes, if you were going to pick a sin....

Annie -- congratulations on your anniversary! I've been in Seattle when it rained. It is beautiful and green there.

Rick -- August was when the church was available. All the EARLY BIRD types had already taken the June dates.

I did some serious OLADing yesterday, and I have just joined Annie on Level 3. Haven't played it yet, just got there and saved.

I got stuck for awhile because I had made an assumption (that there would be exactly three apparitions representing each type of deadly sin) that turned out to be wrong.

I THINK I have figured out the clock. Possible spoiler
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You can only use the clock to advance to a selected color from the position in which you have your back to Famine and and you are directly across from the entrance to Flood. This is the only "view" of the clock that will give you a grasping hand when you put the cursor over a star.

When the game first begins, you can use the clock for any area (click on any star) that the apparitions haven't arrived in yet. Once the apparitions have arrived in the village and "locked in" to their plague area (you've seen that color flashed during the game and the apparitions are now hanging by their artifacts) you must clear the area of apparitions by white-flashing them before you can get the corresponding star on the clock to work.

Occasionally, after white-flashing a plague area of apparitions, the clock flashes the color you are seeking without you having to go click on a star. This doesn't happen regularly enough to rely on though (or at least, I didn't figure out if there was a way to make it dependable).

I think you MUST figure out how to use the clock this way to complete the game or you will find yourself (after the first series of flashes cycles through) twiddling your thumbs waiting for the correct color flash.

When all apparitions have been "freed" from a particular plague area, that color is no longer bright or accessible on the clock.
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Annie -- at the very end of Level 2, did you manage to place the orbs in such a way that you DIDN'T free those black spirit things? I wasn't clear as to whether there actually was a correct order and I blew it, or whether Gar Hob sabotages you no matter what.

Do you think Gar Hob really is the Dark Lord of the 7th Millenium? Or is he an angel with a Jon Stewart sense of humor slumming it for some unknown reason?

Have you noticed at the very beginning of the game that you enter a giant purple tentacle? The whole village area seems to be in/under the tentacle. And in the game-convergence area, it seems that before Uru, Zandi had a radio act on this game.

I've decided that Gluttony (my favorite sin area) should have been a little different. In stead of the mask smoking cigars, there should have been a mask playing a PC game, with stacks and stacks of games next to him. I would edit the dialogue in the area to be something like this:

"I can't get enough of this."
"Never enough."
"Another helping."
"Another round."
"Just one more level."
"If one is good, ten would be better."
"I can't stop until level twenty-six."
"I'll take that one, and that one, and that one."

Hi Rick and Becky! Are we all playing today? The husbandoid finally got off the computer so I can get started.

Becky: I haven't noticed the purple tentacle, though I did catch the Zandi bit. As for the pyramid/orbs thing, I blew it too. I don't think you are meant to get it, as the clues to solving it are in the third level. But I'm incredibly grateful that you reminded me. It may be the solution to my stuckiness if I restart the level and don't release the baddies. Of course, ultimate salivation may require that they be released, but maybe I don't have to let them out til I'm ready for them. Anyway, I'm much comforted that you're up here with me. Let's go get those guys!

Rick: Still waiting by the clock and wishing you success with level 2.

I should have a nice long gaming day. The weather is awful, no rain and mid 80s. Gawd I hate it.

Hey Rick and Annie -- the only way I made it through Level Two was through taking lots of notes. I saved my game at the very beginning of the level, and then just went in and messed around while gathering information. I like this kind of matching stuff, with enough plot to keep me guessing.

The thing I find most difficult is the timed element. Knowing that I have only ten seconds to send an apparition back to the Dark Isle before the apocalypse happens makes me panic!

I have decided that the item in the left arm of the statue-of-liberty (MFer studio) is a mailbox. Every village needs a mailbox, right? I wonder who the postman is.

The manual mentions that Angel is talking to Gar Hob in a throne room. What kind of a throne room, or where I haven't figured out yet.

It's odd that Gar Hob seems to be under the authority of the Judge. Not much of a Dark Lord if you have to hang around waiting for someone more powerful to render a verdict. I think the Bailiff is great! He reminds me of someone...I just realized that he reminds me of the clock character in the Disney version of Beauty and the Beast. Well, his voice reminds me anyway.

Annie -- (possible slight Level 3 spoilers)
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have you been to the other-planet-place in Level Three? Is THAT the Dark Isle? That DOES seem to be where the apparitions are coming from when they first enter (they seem to pop out of the pyramid thing in the Hall of Mirrors).

Annie -- does your stuckiness have anything to do with being cursed? Have you tried to go to the room where you can be purified from the curse?

I'm trying to figure out who Wrath, Spendthrift and Miser are (they are mentioned in the manual). I suspect that they might be regular apparitions but with extra powers. I say this because according to the manual, one of them is supposed to be able to throw you into a random location, and at one point the pursuing apparitions kept booting me back to the mask room despite repeated attempts to white-light-flash them. I might isolate the new apparitions and see which one of them can do this nasty trick to me.
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Hi Becky!

I don't think I am cursed. The manual says that being cursed means the objects and portals won't work until you are purified, while my only problem is that the portals (but only some of them) seem to disappear, never to be found again.
Do you know which room is the purification room? Hope I'll never need it, because I wouldn't know where to go.

I have avoided problems with the skulls and the extra mean spirits by using their objects as soon as I get them to unlock doors, and then releasing them so that their owners won't come after me. I have found a "sin room" for only one of these people, Caligula. He's got one all to himself, nasty man. That seems to imply the others also have their own "sin rooms" too.
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Here's what my stuckiness is: that other planet place has a door which you need to open with the sheep skin. But I simply cannot get there fast enough before the skin's owner catches up with me and takes it away.

I thought if I started the level over and did not release the dark lords, that might help. Don't try it, it doesn't work. Not only does it not work, but when you replay, the colors for each apparition as well as the location where you first find them changes. Might be why there are no walkthroughs, if the game changes each time it's played.

BTW, white light does not work on the three special apparitions when they're trying to get their objects back. You can try moving to another location, but I've found I never have enough time. The only other option you have is to relinquish the object, which really gets up my nose!

See if you can figure out the sheep skin thing, and I'll love you forever! :kiss:


I don't think that the other planet place is the Dark Isle, but there is a "not on this level" door there which may lead to the isle.
Til later!

Annie, I have been enjoying watching you 3 play this game. When I played it some years, I found it incrediby confusing.
I've been thinking that you folks were braving your way through this game without a walkthrough on purpose- but your last msg seems to indicate not. I wanted to point out that there is a walkthrough, but figured you knew, and wanted to do it on your own. So, not wanting to spoil your fun, haven't said anything.
But there is a walkthrough here-
http://www.gameboomers.com/wtcheats/pcOo/OLADhart.htm
Hope I'm not being out of line. But I remember how very difficult this game is, and have been admiring the courage of the 3 of you playing it.
So, hope you don't mind my mentioning it.
P.S. I found the walkthrough about equally confusing as the game.
I don't know, but it might have been added recently.

Thanks, KathyO. I did know about the walkthrough. I guess I meant "walkthroughs." I haven't really looked at the site you give, though, because I'm really really trying to do it myself. Though at the moment I feel like I'd be happy with any cheat I can get! I'm happy we are entertaining you as we stumble along!

Becky and Rick: I am unstuck! Well, I should say, I managed to get passed sheep skin man to use the skin to unlock the door. I have another stuckiness though. Some cursed apparition has taken some of the objects I had and hidden them somewhere. Hope it's not behind a locked door, or I'm cooked.

Hey Kathy O -- before we started OLAD I took a look at the walkthrough, which seemed to be more a Game Guide than a step-by-step walkthrough. We thought we might write a step-by-stepper of the game after we finished. Having played the game, though, and seeing that some things are randomly generated (as Annie noted, portals change from game to game, for instance) it's now pretty clear that a step-by-stepper would be impossible to write.

When we're finished we might either write another Game Guide or we might just add new thoughts as a companion guide to the current walkthrough/guide you linked to. Or after we've finally bagged Gar Hob we might meet in Real Life at some equidistant locationt (say, South Dakota?) and take turns jumping up and down on the bag.

Hmmm. Michigan. That's nicely in the middle. Maybe we'll meet at your house and torture Gar Hob together.

Annie -- Congratulations on beating Sheep-Man!

The purification room is easy to find. The only reason I knew it was the purification room was because when I entered it, a voice kept repeating: "You have been cursed! You have been cursed!" Then it gave me instructions as to how to purify myself. Even after purification, the announcement kept on, but when I left the room and then returned the announcement had stopped.

THanks for the info on redoing the pyramid at the end of Level Two. I won't try it!

Apparitions of Wrath, Miser, Spendthrift, as well as the Dark Lords announce themselves when they are one location away. You have to move away when you first hear them. Once you see them, it's too late. You have to identify what they say (okay, you've ALREADY identified their color, sin, artifact, and memorized their face but hey--what's one more thing?) and then listen for it above the other voices you hear muttering.

I still haven't experienced a disappearing-portals problem. I did get the red/blue/green thing wrong on the pyramid a few times and that zapped all my inventory. I think the portals are still there when I go back to collect them though. I'll let you know if I start experiencing trouble.

Location spoiler for the purification room
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It's the room next to Underground (The Abyss) that's blocked off from entry in Levels One and Two. If you DO go in the room, note the Purple Tentacle reflections in the window. I guess the Purple Tentacle isn't surrounding the Village -- I think now it's the other planet/Dark Isle location that you reach through the pyramid in Hall of Mirrors. YOu don't see the whole tentacle when you travel there in the game -- you just see the whole tentacle at the very beginning of the game right before the sequence where the newspapers come flying at you.

Any guess as to the purpose of the costume in the purification room? I'm trying to understand the symbolism, but it escapes me.
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Possible additional spoilers (sin room discussion and Sheepskin man)
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Annie --
I haven't tried the door that needs the sheepskin lock yet. I had been trying to Redeem Sheep-Man, and am VERY glad I didn't succeed because I would now be without the key!!!! I thought there might be another locked location, because I could only find six locks instead of seven. But I had carefully searched (I thought) and decided it was okay to free apparitions. Glad I blew the freeing part.

I haven't found Caligula's own sin-room. Could you give me a hint as to where it is????

I have been to The Nightly News, which seems to contain Caligula having a conversation with Carlos Marcello. Caligula has an English accent, which surprised me. Why not an Italian accent? These two guys should have been discussing Italy NOW and THEN instead of arguing with one another. Personally, I think Carlos has done Caligula proud. For all we know, he's Caligula's Great-GGGG-Grandson (assuming Caligula didn't kill ALL his children while they were in the womb, of course).

There's also a room where Marie Antoinette has an interesting conversation with Shakem. I've tested them, and I've identified these four characters as the Apparitions of Spendthrift, Miser and Wrath as mentioned in the manual. Good old manual.
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Thanks, KathyO! What's for dinner?

You really don't have to worry about the timed sequences. They never much bothered me. I keep myself will stocked with colored orbs, and blast apparitions with white light every now and then. This keeps the airline stewardess from telling me I have only one minute to blast them. I also keep in mind where there are some apparitions handy in case I need to make a quick blast.

Becky: Thanks for the curses/purification info. I have been in that room and I've never been told I was cursed, so I guess that's not my problem. Didn't they make you put on the robe for a purification ceremony?

Some possible spoilers:
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You've probably already figured it out, but the clues to placing the pyramid orbs properly are found by click on each of the skulls and listening to what they have to say.

I don't think you need to worry about losing a "key" if you redeem a spirit. I remember early on noticing I still had the singing stone after I had redeemed Kabungabunga (or what ever his name is) and realized I needed it to unlock a door. Hope I'm right about this!

Caligula's sin room is the one in which he is having a conversation with Marcello (only I didn't realize it was Marcello, so thanks for that information! Maybe I should try dropping the cigar off in there). But I haven't heard Marie Antoinette having a conversation with Sheep Man. Where is that room???? I thought I had been everywhere at least four thousand times.

I know these guys are supposed to warn you when they are one location away, but I don't think they are honest. At least I don't always hear the warning.

I think that's everything. Now I've got a whole free hour to play before I have to cook the husbandoid's dinner.

Happy gaming!

Also, if anyone has any idea where a bag of stolen objects might be hidden, I'd sure like to know. <img border="0" alt="" title="" src="graemlins/cry.gif" /> I've opened every locked door on this level, I think, and if the game's at all fair the bag can't be on another level. Arrrrrg!

KathyO -- That is so sweet of you! You don't mind guests who invite themselves to your house and bring the Dark Lord of the 7th Millenium as a captive? You are the hostess with the mostest!

Annie -- I had trouble with the sheepskin lock too, until I thought a little more about where the apparitions are at which time.

Possible Spoilers
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Purple tentacle DOES house the Dark Isle (or at least lead to it). I've now seen apparitions start out there on their little journey to the Village and their artifacts. If you blast an apparition with white light, then transportal straight to the Dark Isle, you run right into the apparitions, who immediately take back their artifacts.

Annie -- you are probably having trouble finding the Marie Antoinette room because you don't have the map. The room is El Dorado. It is located near the theater. Look for a star along the wall on the right as you are looking toward the entrance to the theater. You will probably find that El Dorado is locked. There should be something inside of great interest to you now (you mentioned it in a previous post).

Nope, I didn't find out the clue about the pyramid orbs from their skulls. I just experimented with the orbs and got lucky pretty quickly. Okay, I got lucky on the first try.

Well that's an understatement! I doubt a single one of them has ever had an honest thought. The big question is: are the game designers honest? Do they stick to what the manual says? Or, like the Elvis Presley section, do they just eliminate any rules that might be troublesome?

Notice how much the Abyss room resembles the formerly sheepskin-locked room in the Dark Isle? The costume is there, etc. I'm wondering if this is where we redeem the Dark Lords, one in each room. If so, then I am still missing a room because I only have found two.... I'll start keeping my eyes peeled for a stars that might be an entrances to a third room.

Opening up new sin rooms without telling you that's what they are is, IMHO, a bit of a nasty switcheroo on the gamer. I would never have figured it out without first trying to redeem one of the special apparitions in every single regular sin room. And then I would have wondered if I had missed clicking on an orb correctly on one of the seven attempts. I then would have tried again with all seven. I'm VERY glad I read your post and got the hint.
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Wow, thanks for the Marie Antoinette tip! I can hardly wait to get back and try it out!

I did try to save one of the extra special meanies in every sin room. I wasted a lot of time doing that. Finally I tried the Caligula/Marcello argument room, and redeemed Caligula. And guess what: Spoiler
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This is where you redeem Marcello, too! Soooo, looks like the other two could be redeemed in that last hidden room I haven't gotten to yet.


Thanks also for the info about the Dark Isle. I wondered why Sheep Man was always waiting for me there.

I have decided to give up on trying to find the bag of stolen artifacts. I'm going to restore my original game, although this means I'll have to repeat some of what I've already done.

Happy hunting for that third room!

Well! I've now disposed of all four nasties! And I know where the bag is kept that stolen artifacts go into. It's hanging on the wall of Marie Antoinette/Sheep Man's sin room.

I think that's all I'm going to do tonight.

Becky, I think we are really going to need that third room. Hmmm, three skulls and only two rooms. I think I'll start out tomorrow evening looking for stars.

BTW, I tried to redeem the blue eye skull in the purification room, but it didn't work.

Til tomorrow!

Hey Annie -- I tried to redeem the red eye skull in the purification room, and it didn't work either.

Possible spoiler

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However, I tried to redeem the green-eyed skull in the previously sheepskin-locked locked room at the Dark Isle and something very definitely happened.

I had the sound turned down, so I'm not quite sure what DID happen though. It seemed like the beginning of the redemption process, but by the time I got the sound up I didn't hear the judge and the apparition just kept floating around the room. When I went back to Earth Shifts, the green-eyed skull artifact was back. I picked it up again, didn't move fast enough, and Saman cursed me.

Strange, isn't it?

Maybe there are only two rooms -- a purification room and a Dark Lord redemption room. But there seems to be more to Dark Lord redemption than just releasing the right orb and the artifact in the right room.

Oh, and about the clock -- once it has cycled through the beginning sequence of all the stars, if you wait for the "one minute warning" from the stewardess, and then white-light-flash the apparitions in the room of your choice, the next color flash is always that room. Using this method, I got purple to flash three times in a row and I didn't have to touch the clock. Of course, you have to listen to the stewardess but I've grown accustomed to her voice.
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I thought there were only three levels to this game, but there must be four because of the "not this level" message on that door at the Dark Isle. My theory is that the door is the door to the throne room, and Angel and Gar Hob are behind it.

Becky: what interesting things to consider. I hadn't noticed that about the clock. As for the green eyed skull, I'll have to got try that out.

I think you are right about something more beyond three levels. Wasn't there something in the manual about a final, challenging confrontation between us and Hob? I can't remember where I read that. But the final challenge is almost upon us. Annie shivers in dread!

Rick: Are you still with us?

BTW, do either of you know who the "MFers" are? Maybe it was explained in the intro. I should go back and view that again.

Off to the game!

Rick and Becky: Oops! I accidently finished the game. I'm not sure how I did it, and I bet it's a random puzzle so I can't tell you what to do. What a weird ending!

Waiting for you here beyond the pale, so we can have a postmortem on the game. <img border="0" alt="" title="" src="graemlins/bravo.gif " />

Hey Rick -- it's the Olympics. Once every four years. Enjoy!

Hey Annie. Congratulations on finishing the game. I'll join you in a little while, I hope.

Well, according to the manual (my friend and hourly companion) the MFers used to be Druids. Yes, Druids. They made some kind of deal with Saman, Dark Lord of millenium X? (green-eyed skull, I think) who maybe isn't such a Dark Lord after all. He is functionally Evil, but only under duress.

Anyway, Saman gave the Druid/MFers powers to help mankind fight the Dark Lords in the future. It is they who gave us the clock to give us time to figure out how to defeat Gar Hob. Somehow, in the process, they have survived all these centuries to become -- rock stars. Maybe they've achieved eternal youth by white-light-flashing themselves every five minutes for eons?

I assumed that "MFer" was a typically rude band name, but I know so little of that scene that they could be a polo team, moonlighting as a rock band and I wouldn't know the difference.

I've been meaning to go back and listen to everything on the radio now that I'm more acquainted with what's going on. I expect that some background information is there.

I also saw info in the manual about a "trickster". The manual doesn't talk about him/her -- just describes who animated him/her. Does the trickster show up in the final confrontation?

Becky's Best Guesses as to what Happens in the Ending (Choose one):

Possible Spoilers ( yeah, right )
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1. Gar Hob has actually been auditioning Angel for a new Role. It is she who becomes the Dark Lord of the 7th Millenium.

2. Angel discovers that Gar Hob is the evil twin of her love, Paul Jubal. She reaches deep in her soul and finds it possible to love him. Gar Hob is thereby redeemed.

3. The Chosen One comes to the throne room too late. He finds Gar Hob standing over Angel's lifeless body, which is rapidly disintegrating into a rainbow of light.

Gar Hob flings Angel into the Abyss, where she becomes a new constellation. Gar Hob turns the earth into boiling lava, saving only the children in the apocalypse scene who will be the new Adam and Eve when the earth finally cools down.

4. The final confrontation begins as you throw all your orbs at Gar Hob. You must do this in the correct order, which you were supposed to learn from the pattern in the Mask Room, starting with black/white as the first color.

When it seems as though your incompetence will lose the day, the MFers show up and blast Gar Hob into the Abyss with their electric guitars. Gar Hob becomes a constellation. Angel becomes the Earth Goddess, and the MFers go back to building stone circles. Everybody promises to write often.

Hey Annie -- I haven't actually finished yet. The guesses above are just guesses as to what MIGHT be going to happen in the game when I finally do reach the ending.

I've redeemed EVERYBODY on Level 3 except green-eyed skull, and the game won't let me pick him up anymore. Did you, by chance redeem the skulls in the same order that you placed the orbs on the pyramid?

If so, I may have to replay the level in order to get the skulls redeemed in the correct order. Since there are so few saved game slots, I'm pretty sure the only save I have that would work is the one at the very beginning of the level.

Sigh.

Becky: I had two games of OLAD running. In one of them, the objects disappeared from my inventory, and although I could click on them in their places on the apocalyptic devices thingys, I couldn't pick them up. Is this the problem you are having with the green eyed skull? If so, here's the solution if you want it:
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One of the spirits has stolen the skull from you and put it in a bag which (at least in my game) is hanging on the wall in the Marie Antoinette/Sheep Man sin room. When you click on it, the skull will return to your inventory.

Since you haven't finished, here's a helpful bit for the end puzzle. Before you go through the final door, go into the room you opened with the sheep skin. The three spirits there will give you more clues to the final puzzle than you will get it the final room.

Hoping to see you here soon!

Annie -- thanks! I'll check out the bag to see if that releases the skull. I could replay Level Three pretty quickly now if I had to -- we've uncovered most of it's secrets, I think, and with the clock working to my benefit the game is much easier. Still, it'd be nice not to have to repeat everything.

Thanks for the hint about Level Four. Looking forward to it! Just curious -- do we ever actually get to see Gar Hob?

Well, yes, or maybe no. I don't think you'll recognize him.

The bag wasn't there when I went back. What finally worked was starting from a saved game, and then white-flashing Saman's apparition before he got back to his apocalyptic device. Then, for whatever reason, I could pick up his artifact.

I beat it!!!!! I've seen two endings. As to my question about seeing Gar Hob -- yes and no is a very good answer.

The "good" ending is far stranger than any of my guesses. Setting up for a sequel, do you think?

I will now eye anyone named William with suspicion.

The game was VERY different from what I am used to. Do you think it fits in the "adventure" genre?

Just curious --

Serious Spoiler
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The voices we heard as we saw Europa -- were those supposed to be the MFers? Or were those supposed to be Mission Control for the Europa Lander?

If it was supposed to be Mission Control, they got the tone completely wrong. Scientists don't speak that way when they know they are being recorded for posterity. And they wouldn't shut down the feed just because they see something unexpected, would they?

Any ideas as to who that character was? Maybe he's the Trickster, but who/what is that? What could he possibly have to do with what has come before?
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Hurray, Becky! Now I can congratulate you! <img border="0" alt="" title="" src="graemlins/bravo.gif " />

It was a strange ending, wasn't it? When Angel regurgitated that thing! Nasty, nasty thing.

I'd call it an adventure game. It's not role playing, and not really a shoot-em-up. Not shooting, only blasting with white and colored light. Hard to categorize.

As for your questions about the final cut scene, I just don't know. This is one of the problems I have with "plots" in adventure games. There is such a long time between the beginning and the end. The whole long middle is essentially plotless, and by the end of the game I've usually forgotten anything about why we are doing all this.

I think you are right, though, about setting up for a sequel.

I am still perplexed about the bag of missing objects. I wonder if this is another of the random aspects. I think I'll go back later and start a new game, just to see if the bag moves somewhere else. If we are going to write anything like a guide we really should know.

Now that you are done, what are your gaming plans?

Rick, we are rooting for you! Hope to see you here soon.

Hey Annie and Rick -- I'm going back to listen to the radio some more and to experiment with a couple of things. I also want to look at the walkthrough to see if everything we've learned is in there, or if we have something to add.

Annie -- the bag was always in the spot you mentioned in my game too. I think that may be one of the things that stays the same in every game, because the apparition who does the dastardly deed stays the same. Here's what it says about it in the manual:

Just curious -- did you guys finding the game to be repetitive?

P.S. Annie -- did your game force you to save before the final confrontation? I heard one of the Mfers say: "If you don't save now, you'll end up with squat." I could NOT get a "shoes" icon until I hit escape to get to the main menu! Don't think I've ever seen that in a game before.

Thanks, Rick! I am so pleased to have finished this game. It's the first I've ever done completely without a walkthrough, although I couldn't have done it without the two of you! Maybe we could do Darkfall 2?

Becky: I'm so obedient, I just saved when I was told to. Imagine a game making you save, instead of slamming you because you didn't.

Strangely, no, I didn't find it terribly repetitious. I think the adrenaline was running too high, besides the fun of getting into new rooms. All in all, I really enjoyed it. How about you?

Same here. I didn't find it repetitious, I found it difficult! There was a lot to learn and to adjust to in the game because it was so different from the typical adventure game.

The time aspect had me on tenterhooks at first. Then I figured out I could just white-light-flash to extend the game indefinitely. I suppose THAT was the most repetitious part -- running to a room with apparitions in order to white-flash them and delay the apocalypse.

By the third level I would save right at the beginning, so the transportals and sinners didn't change. Then I would just explore and take notes, go back to the beginning with the saved game, and explore and take more notes. When I had all the info I needed, I would do an "attack run" and beat the level.

The one thing that WOULD have mired me in repetition was

Spoiler
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Not figuring out what YOU figured out about the new sin rooms. I would have tried to free those apparitions over and over and over in the wrong rooms!
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You saved me a lot of work! What made you think out-of-the-box enough to do that?

I don't know about thinking outside the box. It's just once I realized I was hearing Caligula (after I had tried to redeem him in every other room), it seemed obvious that I'd found the right place to redeem him. What I didn't realize was that it was Carlos Marcello he was arguing with. I have you to thank for that!

Alida would be fine for me. Do you know when it will be released? We have to finish it, however, before Myst4 comes out, otherwise I will be awol for some time.

Hey Annie -- I read the walkthrough by P. Hart yesterday. It's a good game guide, but I think there are things we can add that will help future OLAD players. I'd like to write a short companion guide with information that doesn't show up in P. Hart's walkthrough.

Would you be interested in contributing?

Email me if you're interested.

Afternoon Becky and Annie,
Just plugging alone(along), with level two.
I must read the end posts for level two. I did a bunch of multi-color apparitions already and I am just now popping off some easy solid color ones. I just stock up on orbs and portals and go on.
Note: My messed up game on level two was because the colors changed from a continued game, Wrote down all colors/apparitions (7/21 level two) and had to start agin at the mask room, with a different seven colors for twenty one. Must save at the start of each level.

AARRRGGGHHH! Yes, you do have to save at the beginning of each level, or some things randomly generate differently. When we write our OLAD Game Guide we'll stress that.

I don't know if you've been avoiding the Spoiler info on this thread. If you have, and if you want some hints about how to use the clock to your adventage, let us know.

Afternoon Becky and Annie,
I was going to read posts today, but I have only five apparitions to redeem on level two. I have used the clock after white light to flash a color star and go back and grab an artifact, now unlocked and unprotected. The book says how to do this. You must be kind of quick though, before the apparition beats you back to their artifact. My next thing to do is to find Avarice/Greed.

Good work Rick! Avarice is by far the hardest to find. Let us know if you need a nudge.

Bonus Hint:
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The map is correct. Look for the same shape that helped you find the other rooms.

Afternoon Becky,
I found Avarice and almost got the last ones. I think I will set up as in level one. I bring the last two artifacts with the same sin, to that room with the last two matching apparitions in hot pursuit. Then redeem them both, plink, plink and then pop back to M'Fer and save. I hope it works.

Yah, level two is in the books.
One more to go!!!!!!
I saved at the start at radiation on level three and will now play around with the free tour. I will now read the posts on help for level two. To see how I could have done this different.

Hey Annie -- somehow I missed your first email. Maybe it's because I have 795 email messages. It's pretty easy to miss one!

I did get the second message though. Your ideas will be a great help.

Rick -- if you can do level two, you can finish the game. You redeem the same number of apparitions on Level 3 -- but they have new powers and are a bit more difficult to deal with. Some of the rules change a bit. Figuring out how they have changed is most of the challenge. Another read-through of the manual (just the part that describes how to play the game) may be in order at this point, and might save you some time later on.

Afternoon Becky and Annie,
This just does keep getting better.
I was thinking, that all had left, were the really, really bad guys, released from the pyramid
at the end of level two.
As I did at the end of level one, I give you my thoughts on they game play of level two.
Notes:
The hidden rooms are now locked. As always go to the mask room and get all the colors/new colors to match them to the apparitions. I started out by unlocking the rooms with the correct artifact.
Then dropping or giving it back, till almost all the rooms were unlocked. The new rooms were very interesting. I then stocked up on orbs and portals and made up a game plan to pick off some the familiar apparitions with the color combos first, as there seems to be many more orbs for the taking. I also kept one apparition as a shadow. This was Droessus/wreath/Avarice as I thought he would be one of the last to redeem. I used him to white light a few times and stop the
clock. I picked him back up time and time agin.
This really helped after I redeemed one or two and the countdown gives you sixty seconds. I would white flash him, pick more orbs and artifacts and him and go on.
I only kept two apparition artifacts at a time in inventory and my shadow's. I did lots of rewrite saves and kept plinking them off. With this game plan and of course using the clock to force apparitions back into play, I had very few timer problems. Oh, Yah, and my end redeem, with two at a time in their same sin room. I hope this will work for me on level three.

A companion to sacrifice for more time? And my favorite apparition -- the one who should have been an American entrepreneur! This never occurred to me. It's a good idea!

On level three there are 7 apparitions that you will NOT want to use this strategy on however! I can't wait until you get there -- tell us what you make of them.

Great going, Rick. I did the same, ie keeping someone handy to zap once in a while. I found this so satisfying I had to wonder at myself. Hope you enjoy level three. The heat's going up!

Afternoon Becky and Annie,
So far on the level three is ok. I did the mask room and got my color matches. I am going slow with finding new rooms and unlocking some others.
I returned, all artifacts, after unlocking. I have took note of the skulls/color eyes. I have yet to make up a game plan. Maybe pick off the easy ones first this time?

so now that you have finished hte gme, how did you like it. do you think it deserves the turkey rating that some sites have given it.

Rick -- DEFINITELY do the easy guys first. If you find an apparition that you simply can't match with a sin/sin room, post here before you've lost your mind!

I've written a chunk of the OLAD game guide, and Annie is also putting together some thoughts on the game. I'll be sending what I have to you and Annie for comments, and then add in Annie's thoughts, if that's okay.

Zanthia -- no, it doesn't deserve a stinker rating. I don't think I'll review it, because it's kind of late for a review at this stage! But I was thinking of using the game as a way to throw together some thoughts on innovation in games -- why certain innovations work and others just trigger a stinker rating!

Um, Zanthia did you think it deserved stinker status?

BTW -- the walkthrough by P. Hart IS excellent -- that's probably the one you remember. I read through it a couple of days ago to see how complete it is.

There is some stuff left out of it because you can play the game different ways. A traditional, step-by-step walkthrough, which we hoped to write when we started, is impossible for this game because so many factors are randomly generated, and therefore parts of the game are different for each person who plays.

Still, I think there are things we can add to our own game guide that will help gamers who play the game from here on in.

Afternoon Becky,
So far on level three is a cake walk. I have fourteen guys redeemed and setting up for the last seven.

Go Rick! The end is in sight!

And Zanthia, no, I agree with Becky. Once I got the hang of what needed to be done, I had a really good time. Too bad more people didn't feel that way.

i agree with you guys that it does not deserve to be called a stinker at all. i believe i told you that before you started playing. for whatever reason this game has received a really bad rep.

Afternoon Becky and Annie, Game plan,
Check portals back and forth to go quick with a Dark Lord artifact, right to their sin room and redeem.
I shall start with Cal and Carlos (news), then Marie and Shakam to where? The map shows a room, right of the clock, El Dorado. I must find it. Then, I don't know, take a skull to the pyramid? Then two ? First thought on the reviews from people in articles and sites posting bad reviews. If you did not complete the game as I have yet to do, hold your comments to just what you have completed, as I have.
Did Auryn Quest get boring just grabbing energy balls, with the jumping stuff and only end world saves. Did these people rip Myst, because you have you go through agin and do the same to pick up the other page, after you solved the puzzles to get there? How about Shivers, pot/lid/xupi and moving xupi to find agin? The only other timer type game, that I played is The Last Express, in real time, WOW!!!
OLAD is like nothing that I have played before.
Anyhow,
Wish me lots of luck.
I am on to get the Dark Lords and win!!!!

Rick and Annie -- I'm making a list of things that DON'T change from game to game. Could you take a look at your notes and see if you get the same information as this:

Spoilers for anyone not yet at Level Three:

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Artifacts that open locks

Level 2

Lust &#8211; the guitar
Passage of Time &#8211; the oyster
Pride &#8211; the mirror
Avarice &#8211; the spiral singing stone
Anger &#8211; ying\yang
Gluttony &#8211; the clown mask
Envy &#8211; the exotic flower

Level 3

Pride &#8211; the money purse
Earth Shifts &#8211; the cigar
Flood &#8211; the wood-handled dagger
El Dorado &#8211; red-eyed skull
Passage of Time &#8211; blue-eyed skull
Plague &#8211; green-eyed skull


The color of plague rooms

Famine &#8211; red
Radiation &#8211; blue
Earth Shifts &#8211; green
Plague &#8211; purple
War &#8211; light blue
Flood &#8211; white
Poisoned air &#8211; yellow


The colors made by combining orbs

Purple &#8211; red plus blue
Yellow &#8211; red plus green
Light blue &#8211; Green plus blue

A question about randomness -- did you get the sense that the star color flashes (the first sequence before you hear the "You have one minute" message) were randomly generated. I didn't pay THAT much attention to the sequence, but since starting a new game generated a different color flash, I ASSUMED they were random.

What do you think?

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Rick -- if you want to know where El Dorado is...

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As you are facing the Hall of Pride, look on the right where you see a star on the side of the building. I think it's a blue star.
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Rick -- in some ways, OLAD reminds me of Auryn Quest. Both games are innovative enough to be out of the mainstream and quirky -- though in different ways.

But both are also difficult enough that many gamers have trouble adjusting to the gameplay, and LOTS of trouble finishing without a step-by-step guide. Auryn Quest didn't have that (unless you bought the strategy guide) and OLAD didn't have that because the game is built in such a way that providing a step-by-step guide is impossible.

Quirkiness, combined with difficulty made them inacessible to many gamers. If you figure out a way to make them more acessible, more people will play and finish them.

Playing as a group makes them more accessible because two heads (or twenty heads) are better than one. But most adventure games aren't played the way we've been playing these -- as a group, with lots of help from one another. Playing games as a group makes the gaming experience significantly different and more fun, especially with a quirky, difficult game.

Hey Rick and Annie -- one last question: (well, until the next last question):

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when you kept your companion apparition around and repeatedly zapped him/her, IF you waited until the "You have one minute" stewardess message, did the game ALWAYS flash the color of the apparition you were using as a companion? (This assumes that you were ONLY carrying around the artifact form your companion, and not also carrying another artifact with another color.)

Afternoon Becky,
Your color combos and lock artifacts are correct.
I cannot say on color of all the Plague rooms, I guess you used the clock a lot more than I. There were only a few times that I white flashed and ran back to the clock to force the apparitions. The red,green and yellow rooms, are in my notes. You see that I was also watching the Olympics and would go to room where the artifacts and their apparitions were, that I wanted to redeem and wait for the one minute warning. Then white light and pick up what I wanted and pop over to their sin room(s), redeem them and pick up more orbs on my way to next set and save. Resume and wait and watch the games and repeat. Heck, I even had the three orbs highlighted, so I would just spin back and hit the spacebar. As you said that the Olympics are only every four years. Talk about low stress gaming. Now the games are over and I have the last seven left to go. The heat is on!!
I did not use a companion on level three, for that matter, I did not even use a portal yet!!!!
I thought that I would, but with the slow pace and planning out moves like a chess game or computer Basic,(if,then,go,to,and), it was not needed. In the other levels there were times that after redeeming the apparitions, that you wanted to, the clock would start ticking and the companion was there to white flash. Then I would collect up orbs and my companion artifact and moved on.
I cannot say if the color for Droessus was the first flash after, as I was in so much of hurry to get his artifact and orbs, in case the timer started agin. I was more scared in level two then I have been in level three. Slow is good !!!
I know, I know, this will change very soon.
Thanks for the input on game play. It was a very good conversation, Katsumoto.

Becky: I thought the colors were different for the plague rooms. I'll have to go back and check again. Also, I'll be sending you my thoughts tonight. At last. I've been slowed down by deep meditations on the game.

Okay, Becky, I just turned in my term paper. Please let me know if it doesn't arrive.

And as usual, once I sent it I thought of a few more things, which I don't think we have touched on yet. First, why oh why do we have to re-redeem apparitions. Does the game ever say why they don't stay redeemed?

Second, have you or Rick (Hi Rick!) explored the Customized Level? I was happy enough with the standard level and so I never got around to it.

Finally, the manual mentions passwords to activate Millennium Freebies. What a shame the OLAD site is gone and we will never know what the freebies were! <img border="0" alt="" title="" src="graemlins/cry.gif" />

Nope. Haven't explored the Customized Level. I had my hands full just with the Free Tour and the regular game!

I'm still experimenting a bit with the game to confirm how things work. There is a surprising level of strategy that you can apply once you know the game (in my case, AFTER I had beaten it). The strategy element is disguised by the fancy graphics and the bios and the multitude of inventory items and Gar Hob alternately cracking jokes and making threats. I had thought this was an identification and matching game with a timed element. I hadn't thought of it as an observation/experimentation/strategy game.

Yes, it's too bad we missed the Freebies. Still, we didn't need those little extras to defeat Gar Hob. We did it without the extra help!

Might be fun to own one of those jack-in-the-boxes, wouldn't it?

I wondered about the re-redeeming aspect myself. Especially Gacy, whose soul apparently is put through the spiritual/subatomic shredder after Level One. How do they manage to reconstruct him? (Have you taken his artifact to the clock? I nearly cried.)

Afternoon Becky and Annie,
Just a quick note:
I hope to get a block of time, this long weekend to finish, OLAD ! I have yet to use the red eyed skull to unlock, El Dorado. Then maybe my game plan will work. Maybe I can get lucky, with the pyramid? Are you guys going to be around, if I need a hand? I know, this board, someone is always there to help. Sometimes a Boomer just jumps in, that is so sweet.

Late Evening Becky and Annie,
I found the El Dorado and redeemed Carlos and Caligula. Oh, ya and Marie !!
I thought I redeemed the sheep skin guy. Gar Hob said he was. I picked red eye skull and went to the mirror room and was toast. I was thinking just the three skulls and down to the mirrors. The whole gang was there. No fair play!

No fair indeed! Most of the "whole gang" in the mirror room are apparitions you have redeemed. I guess you must have run into a live one. I forget what the red eyed skull is for. Do you need to go to the mirror room?

Morning Annie,
The Stitchman over in the garden has a great thread on Doubles. Double posts!!! I had lots of fun with it.
Do you check out the other boards, here on Boomers? I must jump around this site more than most. My posts are all over this great site.
Anyhow,
The red eye skull is Quechua. I thought that I read a post, that said there is another room down in the hall of mirrors, yes? In the Pyramid ?
Why would the Shakem Ben-Jamin, sheep head , still be in inventory. I redeemed him.
I will try to find this other room first.
By my count, I have just three skulls, red, green and blue left. That is Quechua, Alexander and some guy named Amratus, Cain or Admah-Najeh and he is blue. What's with that?

Hi Rick: Yes, the pyramid does lead to another place. Have you solved the pyramid puzzle yet?
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You don't need the skulls to solve the puzzle, but you do need the information you get when you click on them.

As for the sheep skin still being in inventory, it's because you'll need it to unlock the door you'll find at the new place.

Be careful carrying skulls around as the owners can do nasty things to you. Best just to drop them until you know what to do with them. Which you will soon. Good luck! I should be around to help. All my birthday plans are cancelled, or at least postponed since we've got a pipe leaking in the TV room downstairs, and plumbers on major holiday weekends are not easy to find!

Morning Annie,
I only have Quechua(red eyed skull), left to redeem. Then I may solve the last puzzle, in the throne room. This guy makes my eyes red.
I have tried many different ways, but I am not fast enough. He takes my inventory and curses me with Plague. I have four saved games with this one guy. Should I try and find the curse removal room? I even made it up the spiral staircase once, before he laughs and zaps me.
I did manage to stop the clock once. I had both rows of inventory filled up with orbs and portals.
I was waiting at Radiation to get the blue eye skull. You know, after the timer starts, white light and then pick up the artifact.
No count down for over twenty minutes. I had to white light and go out to clock and force the artifact back into it's spot to pick it up.
Anyhow,
After 9+21+20=50, you would think I could do number 51.

Hi Rick!

I think you should go get purified. I was never cursed (she said smugly), but I gather from the manual that your orbs and artifacts won't work til you come clean. The purification room is, I think, the one down the tunnel that you can't get to at the beginning of the game. That is, the tunnel that goes in the opposite direction from the tunnel to the mask room.

As for your other situation, with the red eyed skull meanie, I had to laugh Hope any of this makes sense. I check back later to see how you are doing.

Right now I think I'll go look for this garden forum. Sounds intriguing!

Annie ,
I did it, no pure room thing needed.
I just had to use the portals faster.
Angel puked up the Gar Hob guy and I guess we wait for Williams. Loved the Sagan explorer and the little space man guy. I had the sound turned down and did not here about insert disk one.
I thought I was stuck.
Let's see, one month, heck three years, to get it completed.
I will post some notes about level three later.
Put this one in the books, done ,done ,done!!!

Yay Rick! Congratulations! was it three years) ago Brave Annie, Beautiful Becky and Rick the Smart were the chosen ones to save the world ... again. How bravely they worked together to wrest artifacts from apocalyptic devices, racing to deposit them in their proper spots to redeem nasty apparitions from their nasty sins. And then doing it all over again on the next level. Many were the distractions. Rick had to balance saving the world with teenage units and watching the Olympics. Becky had her anniversary trip with her PCU, as well as getting two daughters off to college. And poor Annie's cats, unable to find Annie's lap, decided Annie's laptop would do just as well, thereby clogging the works with hair. And still they fought on and once again saved the world from apocalyptic doom, not to mention learning to spell apocalyptic. They were not just amazing, they were amazingly amazing.

Oh, we three, we happy happy three!

There's a lot to explore there and to orient yourself in. I've been playing it for several hours, and I'm just starting to figure out where everything is!

BTW -- OLAD spoiler:

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On Level Three, when you did the pyramid puzzle, did you find that the answer was (Left to Right)
Green, Blue, Red? Both my games had that solution. I'm wondering is this is one of the things that does NOT randomly generate.
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Oh, sorry, but it is random. I got blue red green on my first game and green red blue on the second.

As for Alida, I'm enjoying it, I just can't "do" it. If it were real life, I'd just have to move into one of the cabins and wait for someone to rescue me.

Annie -- if you can do OLAD without a walkthrough, surely you can do anything!

Too bad the orbs are random there. Noted for the record.

Afternoon Becky and Annie,
Level three Notes:
I did manage to stop the countdown clock. I was very careful with the locks. The orbs on the pyramid are most random. I wonder if the colors to redeem apparitions are also random as some changed. I do not think this game is a stinker.
I do not how it could be completed, without a map, manual and lots of notes.
Best of luck with Alida. I hope to pick it up soon and play.

Thanks Rick! I'll add in your notes to the manifesto. I printed it up again this morning and it is currently 12 pages long. I think I may have gone overboard in the loquaciousness department and am currently editing it down some.

Then again, I became inspired last night to think about ADDING some of my own thoughts to the Game Philosophy section started by Annie. So it may end up even longer. I hope to send it to you for comments via email in a day or so.

Rick -- when you say you stopped the countdown clock, did the clock actually stop color flashing? I remember you mentioning something about it earlier. How did you get it to do that?

Just to double-check something: Rick did you find that:

Spoilers
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Radiation was blue
Famine was red
Poisoned air was yellow
Earth Shifts was green
Flood was black/white
War was light blue
Plague was purple?

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Thanks!

Evening Becky and Annie,
I wrote long notes for levels one and two. Since I posted a bunch on level three there was not much more to add, that you two had not covered.
I would say that I played the second half of this game much more reactive, rather than proactive, as you have done. I did not push the star clock very much. I stocked Orbs and waited at the rooms, or near them, where the artifact I wanted was. Then when the countdown started. I would go in and white light, pick up the artifact, go to the correct sin room, redeem them and set this up again and again. I filled up both rows with orbs and portals, that while waiting the flash/countdown did not happen. It really did not help, after twenty minutes, I had to white light and go to out to the clock an put my cursor grabbing hand on the one star that was working and then go back and sit and wait a few moments, flash, countdown and do as I have done just a few times before.
I guess, I would say that we played this wild game in our own way. That is a good thing !!
If anyone has this OLAD sitting on a self and thinks that they can't do it........
We three say, " It Can be Done."

Well, the OLAD Game Guide/Walkthrough is now posted! MaG has stickied it at the top of the page, but you can also link to it here .

It looks good, doesn't it? MaG did a great job with it!