Oblivion leveling questions

Here's a couple of questions I can't seem to find the answer to.First some facts to set up the questions

Atributes are like speed, inteligence and strenght

Skills are like athletics, alchamy and heavy armor

It takes 10 of your major skills to level.

Without enchantment your atributes top out at 100

Everytime you level you can raise 3 of your attributes up to 5 points untill each attribute hits 100.

OK what if all your major skills are 100 so you can't level anymore but some of your minor skills are less than 100 can you still build the minor skills as you play or do they just freeze ????

And what happens when all but 2 or 1 of your atributes are toped out at 100 but you still can level because some of your major skills haven't hit 100 yet. Can you still add to atributes when you have less than 3 choices. That is as long as you can still level can you add to say 'luck' even though all your other atributes are 100.

Just wondering and most of the guides tell you how to level and all that but not what happens towards the end.

Hope these questions make sense. I really want to know so I can plan ahead a little while I play.

I don't know actually. I never bothered to play that far. I am curious as well...it's not as if there's any danger of it happening unless one takes very very long time to finish the main quest.

If I could hazard a guess, I would say the developers have balanced it out in one way or another so that it all evens out, putting all your skills at maximum at the same time as your attributes. After all, the amount of attribute points you get to spend seems to be beased on how much you have gained in that particular area of skills, so I would guess some smart person has figured out a way to balance them against eachother.

Or maybe it just stops.

Drizzt
I think I will end up playing that far because I like to try to manage things to get 5 points for my 3 atributes each time (more or less). Its not that hard, I do quests for a while and then hit the dungeons or explore to buff up my skills for each level. Anyway if no one can tell me I'll save my saves for each level towards the end so I can go back if I can't max out something I want to.

I hope someone who has play that far can answer but if not I will come back and post what I find out.

Off to go where no Oblivion player on Gameboomers has gone before. (that's a joke)

Do tell us of your findings.

There's no need to go back to a previous save before finishing the game. With the main quest finished, the game isn't over. You can still travel around in the world and complete quests.

I've played both Morrowind and Oblivion for months on end, and have never even come close to maxing out stats and abilities. So you could be at this for a while.

Hagatha
I have maxed out strenght, endurance, agility and my speed is 75, and I am working on willpower and intelligence and I throw in personality about every three levels when I sell all my loot....I'm not sure what level I am but I know it is under 20 (I just looked, I'm level 18). I'm pretty sure I will find out the answers to my questions, but I sure wish I knew what to expect. I've playing oblivion since it came out but not huge hours every week. I like to just play along doing quests but then when its about time to level up I go and find bad guys to fight so I can get 5's. I level up kinda slow.

It just seems like people would wonder what happens as they come close to maxing out but I've never seen anyone mention it.

You right about skills...it takes a long time to work them up...my best are heavy armor, sneak and what's the one that fixes your damaged armor those are all over 75. I try to keep my blade, blunt and hand to hand with in a couple of points of each other and right now they are all between 60 and 65.

I play Marrowind alittle different....I don't try to get all the points I can when I level up..I just play. But I found Oblivion a little boring (all the caves etc and lands are so much the same SO I manage my leveling and that helps keep me interested. Its kinda like my own personal quest.

I know what you mean. Oblivion is a beautiful looking game, but there is a sameness to it after all.

My personal quest was to have a furnished home (or hovel) in every town. And then I decorated them with every object I could find.

I knew I was getting bored with Oblivion when I put on all my chameleon enchanted gear. Hopped up on top of one of the gazebos in the main city and started shooting low-power spells and arrows at the guards and citizens just to watch them run around trying to find where the attack is coming from.

It's actually pretty funny to do when you are at 95-110pts chameleon so pretty much totally invisible, plus combat does not nullify the effect. The guards and citizens end up in a mass of people running around either single file or in a loose knit group with manic looks on their faces like the A.I. freaks out. It's actually a little creepy...

Nipomo, there is a way around your dilemma. You need to get cursed or something. I can't remember what specifically, but something bad can happen to you in the game that reduces some of your stats, allowing you to do a bit more levelling.

And yes, wasn't the gorgeous sameness of Cyrodill a disappointment after the Any-Crazy-Assed-Thing-Could-Be-Over-The-Next-Hill feeling you got from Morrowind? Plus the Morrowind map was much, MUCH larger.

If they could make a game with the tightness and coherence of Oblivion with the spectacularly strange, vast, and diverse environments of Morrowind, they'd have a game for the ages.

Though I could never finish Morrowind, I never got tired of just exploring.

i'm similar here nipomo. currently my main char is 100 in all but 3 attributes, one is at 50 or just over and the other two a bit under.

was wondering the same myself. my problem however is that char has finished virtually every quest in oblivion, knights of the nine, and all the downloaded content included in the retail states version. why i'm mostly in the shivering isles now.

however i messed up with that char making his prime attributes the most commonly used ones, so he is around the early 30s in level, think 32-33.

though on the exploration, that wasn't as big with me as the ease of combat. personally i like the easier combat, the downside is you fly through the quests too quick.
heck i had one magick based char that ran through the dark brotherhood and mage's guild quests and never made it to level 2.

i also mad an 'evil' argonian, i liked him. i literally went through every city and kvatch and killed. kvatach i killed everyone alive the game allows, in all the other cities [except the imperial city] i killed EVERY guard i could find and could kill. i was methodical on that trust me. unfortunately you return to a city later and all the guards back.
sadly at one point my mouse skipped while the game was trying to load and caused me to click go to jail instead of resist arrest, so my wonderful bounty went away.

i'll have to check that char, i got his bounty up to a few hundred thousand gold, yeah i wasn't even bothering with sneak, i just came in and started killing with a blade. i didn't die once till i finally went into the main gate of the city [one closest to the stables] before enough ganged up to kill me, and that was mostly the two archers cause the other 4 infantry crowded me and i couldn't get past them. but i finally killed 3 of them and was 1-2 hits from killing the 4th before the archers finally got me.
have to check his level too, think he was only lev 10-12 or so, might be 15, doubt more then that though.

so my complaint was less the ease of combat then the speed of quest completion. but it balances as i hated having to get stats to a given number on morrowind. several times it said i needed a skill at 90 before i could reach the highest rank, yet those where you have to kill someone to become the new leader i killed them with relative ease, though those fights were more challenging, is stil got the top rank with the highest skill at 80 instead of what was said to be 90.

what i like best is the general ranking bonuses such as after one rank in stealth [believe apprentice or journeymen] the weight or your boots no longer effects if you are given away when running while in stealth mode.

I thought I made out ok with my altercation with the Vampires earlier in the game, but it seems that I got infected. I came out from closing my 4th Oblivion Gate and started losing health, and could not figure out why until I talked to someone and "cure for Vampirism" was in my conversation options.

Now I have 5 or 6 active quests and can't decide which way I want to go next. Some of them had to be put on hold until certain skills are increased. I wanted to get the cure for Vampirism, but I have to find 5 greater soul stones to take to the witch and no telling what else after that. I really suck at picking the "hard" locks, and the greater soul stones I need are locked up in display cases in one of the Mages Guilds.

I've become pretty engrossed in this game. I can see how these RPGs can grow on you.

it is grand soul gems, not greater. and they have to be empty. you can also buy them, though that is expensive. that is the harder part of that quest really.

as to the picking of locks... there is a trick around that, though have to finish another quest, but if your char is lock picking focus [a stealth class], then it is really worth the effort.

the shrine of nocturnal gives the best benefit for that, i don't want to say too much because i don't want to spoil anything, but will say that the shrine is north of leyawiin. however i don't want to say more then that, so just head north and look around the the shrine icon to show on your compass and head for it.
her statue is of a woman in a large hooded poncho with both arms out to her side as though on a cross, with a couple animals on her wrists.

go there and finish the quest, if you are a stealth based character or you just really have trouble with locks the reward is certainly worth the quest which is fairly easy.

Thank you PDL, I'll go find that Shrine and complete the quest next. I really want to cure my Vampirism, and I don't have a lot of money to buy those gems.

The vampire cure quest is a bit of a pain, but sure does challenge you to be alert. No sunlight and everybody gets an attitude toward you...

After the umteenth time I played Oblivion and the expansions (shivering isles excluded) I finally figured out the easiest way to assure yourself not to get infected (I'm a little slow on the pick-up ). Always visit a healing shrine after battling vampires. That way if you missed the little pop-up text that states you're infected the "gods" take care of your lapse of attentiveness

Yeah, you are somewhat restricted as a Vampire. You can't fast travel during the day either. I found that I can fast travel in daylight and sunlight doesn't hurt me if I feed on someone. There's usually somebody snoozing near any of the stables at night. I get a quick drink and I'm ok for a while

yeah you have to feed to travel during the day, also the one mod avilable online or in the retail states version of knights of the nine also helps as it is designed for a vamp char, the 'vile lair' for those wondering. takes money to build it up, but still for a vamp char it helps when you have it done.

though if you go long enough without feeding you get the one greater power to charm people into liking you so you can buy stuff, however you can only use it once per day and you still have to hide from the sun.

though it is real easy to get it in oblivion, though in morrowind i had a char continually hit over and over till she was near death and i had to bug out of the dungeon to avoid death, and continued that for weeks at 3-4 locations, and she still never caught it.

Thanks, PDL

I have a feeling I'm going to be playing this games for months. That's actually a good thing as I'm really starting to enjoy it.

I've totally forgotten about doing the main quest. I keep on running into these side quests and I'm a sucker I guess, I always say "yes...what the hay..I'll help"

Is there any repercussion from not paying enough attention to the main quest?

...and if so, If I focus on the main quest, will all (or most) of my other side quests still be there if I complete it?

Hi,

This game is just like morrowind. You can keep on playing and doing whatever quests you run into or have not finished once you finish the main quest.

If you want to wait and continue other quests first then you can continue those and don't worry about the main quest.

Its not a problem either way.

My first guy that I played I focused on the main quest and once that was finished it felt like a really short game.

Now I have 3 more people going and it will take a really long time to finish everything there is to do in this game.

There are Guild quests.

There are quests given by people you talk to or overhear them talking to someone else.

There are quests given by statues you find in the wildreness.

So to answer your question. Yes the quests will still be there.

You just won't have to worry about Oblivion gates popping up anymore or the big guy at the end.

the elder scrolls series is known for letting players do what they want, you don't even have to play main quests at all if you don't want to.

Robert, my advice is actually to stay away from the main quest as long as possible.. If you jump into it early the story line get's a little quirky afterwards.

Thank everyone. I'm not sure how far I am into the main quest, but I've done quite a lot. The last time I saw Jauffre, I was told to go to the various cities throughout Cyrodil and get all the leaders to send help to defend the garrision. I've gotten 3 of them to send troops so far.

This "find help" quest has lead me to all these other side quest, and getting turned into a Vampire, which has lead me on series of other quest.

VHL, you mentioned Oblivion Gates "popping up". I hope the ones I've already closed won't re-open if I ignore the main quest for a while. I'd like to get my weapons, magic and armor built up before I have to deal with the big boss at the end of the main quest.

I noticed when I closed one of the gates I got one of those Sigil Stones (or whatever they are called), that attach magic powers to my weapons and make them far more effective, which is really cool. I should probably save those powers as much as I can, as those magic gems that recharge them seem rather hard to come by...most of the ones I find have no power in them.

I also joined the Mages Guild, and I have to have a letter of recommendation for whatyamacallit. I went into the sewer, found the dead guy, got the ring of burden, then the dude I was supposed to give it to to get my letter was gone. Now I have to track him down.

I figured I could learn some magic powers from the Mages, but apparently I have to complete a bunch more side quests before that will happen. All the ones I've approached so far, it says "this person cannot teach you any new skills".

I guess I'm probably having to do things hard way, as I haven't much money (only about 1000 gold), and it seems rather hard to come by.

I have gotten the hang of using persuasion. I was able to max out that woman's dispostion to make her confess to stealing the painting in the Castle.

I feel like there's still sooo much I have to learn, and so far I've only scratched the surface.

I love it!!

I'm so glad you're having a good time Robert! It's sure fun to get involved in those worlds. Others that have played can sure tell you more, but I understand the stones are what's good about the gates.

when you close a gate it stays closed. sigil stones can enchant things yes, they can enchant armor or weapons but not both, simply use it on the weapon or armor you want to use it with.

to get new spells you buy them, not train them. there is at least one in each mage's guild. you don't have to join to buy them, however after a point in the mage's guild quest you can gain the benefit of making your own spells and enchanting weapons and armor using only money [though a lot of money], both of those get some getting used to, but definately useful.

the picture that looks like someone meditating is to improve your skills [sneak, destruction, etc], the two arrows that make a circle is buying normal things [ingrediants, armor, weapons, etc], there are also two others. one is to buy new spells the other is to pay gold to recharge your enchanted items.

also soul gems that have a soul rating you can use to recharge enchantments to varying amounts [based on the rating level], however if you find an empty one, get a 'soul trap' spell. this allows you to cast the spell on a target, and if you kill them before the spell wears off you trap their soul in a soul gem, it is now a charged gem and can be used to recharge your magical items.

however each soul gem has a value as does each soul, a soul must be placed in a soul gem of equal or greater power.
the power levels i believe are; petty, lesser, common, greater, and grand. however if i am remembering wrong someone feel free to correct me.
however my point on this is that to trap say a common soul you'd need a common to grand soul gem to trap the soul. if a petty soul then any gem will trap it. if a grand soul ONLY a grand soul gem can trap it.
again the higher the soul power level the more of a recharge it provides.

again go to the various members of each guild hall and if you see a button that has a picture of anything other then a face, the trading arrows [the two arrows making a circle], or the figure meditating then click on that new symbol.
again it will either offer pay to recharge items [shows a picture of the item to be recharged and gives a price amount], and the other sells you spells [shows a list of spells that person teaches and how much they charge]. this latter one is the one you want on buying spells. also if you place the curser over the spell without clicking it will tell you the school of magick it belongs to [destruction, restoration, conjuration, etc] and will also list additional notes such as 'you don't have enough magicka' or 'destruction level needed 20' or similar responses, in these you can't use that spell yet because your skill level isn't high enough or you don't yet have enough magical power to cast the spell. however if it doesn't say either then you can cast it fine.
also along with the price of the spell it also lists the magicka amount you need to cast the spell. at the top it shows the words name followed by two symbols. one being a lightning bolt with an arrow the other being a coin with an arrow. the coin is the price of the spell, the lightning bolt is the magicka amount needed.

you can stop the main quest at any point and come back to it later at any point from my understanding. so go ahead and take a break, do some side quests, make some money, buy spells and such... when you are ready go back, as the main plot just gets more fast paced [or at least feels more fast paced] after you get everyone to lend troops.

Even though you're at the "gate closing" point of the main quest you can still drag that out. I believe there is something like a maximum of 60 or so gates that you can end up closing if you wish. Also, traveling through the cities and doing other quests at the same time will put a different spin on things. Some folks just jump around closing gates amd as a result miss a number of things that are triggered by the gates opening... so take your time and have fun...

A trick about the sigil stones: Make a separate game save just before entering a gate. After you get the sigil stone, if it doesn't have the powers you want just go back to that save and try again. They are randomly generated so it's kind of like playing Daedra Roulette!

You can also have your items recharged at mages guild locations by the approprite mage. It's expensive, but there should come a point in the game where money is not an issue. There is also a stone you will come across in certain ruins called a Varla stone. This can recharge all of your enchanted weapons at once to 100% (single use only). They are rare, so try to hang on to one or two for the main battle, they'll come in handy.

Sweeeet. Nice tips folks. I'm learning more and more just by playing. I'll have to get that "soul trap" spell. That's sounds like the easiest way to recharge my weapons without spending a lot of money or searching all over creation.

I'll certainly be glad when "money is not an issue". I get paid for some of these quests I go on, but I haven't gotten anything substantial yet.

This game is like a little world of it's own. The amount of detail is awesome. I've never played anything like this before. Grand Theft Auto games are similar, but not nearly as detailed and open ended.

Nickie, you've got to play this. It's amazing!!

i mentioned the bit about mages recharging for you in exchange for money, however with all i posted no surprise it got passed over.

and yeah soul trap is the best for recharging things with minimal cost, and there is more then one form of the spell, the more expensive ones last longer making it easier to catch the soul.

and as you go up in level you have tougher threats, however they also have better armor and weapons, use what you want and sell the rest, another way to get money, take everything you can from every corpse untill you can't carry anymore.

also when you look at your inventory, inside corpses and containers you have like 4 symbols above each item [sometimes 3, pending on the type of item].
the gold symbol is the value of the item [pay attention to that early on], a dagger which i believe is the attack value of the item [weapons mostly], a shield [the defense value i believe.], and a heart. the heart isn't always present as it is the percentage of damage of the item. 100 is perfect condition, 0 it breaks [but can be repaired]. however at a certain point if you invest enough in the armorer skill you can repair items so they are higher then 100.

but back to my point, the value of the item is what you pay attention to. if you haven't finished a quest or such and you have too much stuff so you can't move anymore, then look at the values and drop the stuff of no value or lower value, so the higher the number under value, keep it. or if you are trying to loot a corpse but are weighed down too much [over-encumbered] then take the higher value items and get rid of the lower value stuff.

either way the moment you are able [especially if you've gone awhile without doing so] go to shops and sell off the extra stuff you don't use, have no use for, have no intent to use, or the like. it will help you get extra money early on. after money stops being an issue you can continue that tactic or not, as by then it doesn't matter much.
and if you are the type to worry over morals remember this. historically you think common soldiers on the battlefield would pass up taking a piece of armor that fit them or a weapon that was better then their own?

also historically battlefield looting was common practice pretty much world wide, so take what you want, they dead, not like they can use it anymore. and on games if they do come back they get new equipment. [evil grin]

but jokes aside it is a great way to get money early on, especially at higher levels when the better weapons and armor comes along and you can get hundreds or thousands for each piece.
also remember the more a shop keeper likes you the better deals you get.

also of note, when selling armor and such only those things that particular shop keeper will buy will show up on your sell list. get used to smiths they will be those you will visit most often with this method as you'll mostly sell weapons and armor. but what they won't buy use common sense and think who'd most likely buy that item. smiths, general traders, alchemists... then simply go to them and sell.

and a note that took me forever to realize [yes i was slow on this one] on potions you click on them you drink them, poisons however you don't drink, click on them and it asks which weapon you want to put it on. place the curser over the poison without clicking to see what spell effect it has, you can check the manual or guess what that effect does, or use the simpler method of using it and see.

poisons and potions pop up a lot, and some you can get a fair bit of money for so decide which suit you best and sell the rest.

simple rule to get extra gold early on though, take everything you can and what you don't use, sell.

Sorry Robert, Oblivion is the second game that I have been unable to play on my computer! It won't install - just installs acrobat reader or whatever, and no option to install the game...If that was something fixed with a patch, I have dial-up so I don't.

i didn't have a problem downloading mine, just the drive clicks for like 5 mins when you put it in or boot up the comp [from sleep mode or reboot/boot if i forget to take the disc out] but after that it works fine.

however without system details can't comment too much on the possible probs with it. but it is either hardware, software problems, or simply a bad disc.

but yeah a pain, is a fun game, hence all the babbling fro m those of who have played it.

Not an uncommon problem Nickie. There are a few possible reasons. Here is a couple things to check...

Does your computer meet the requirements of the game? Not sure, but there might be a fail safe check on the disk that would not bring up the install selection if your system does not meet the minimum req's.

If you have Roxio installed, uninstall it, restart and then try loading Oblivion. Plays havoc with some DVD check routines... Similar burning tools could also cause an issue.

Do you have any games loaded that use the Starforce copy protection tool? If you do then you'll have to uninstall them and get the tool that uninstalls Starforce. See link below...(scroll to the bottom of the page to find the download link).

Starforce removal tool

Oh, and if you do install it you will NEED the latest patches. Oblivion was released in true "hack-and-slash-code-without-testing-cause we-have-a-really-cool-graphics-engine-and-people will-buy-it-anyways" style and had terrible bugs. One reason I really have issues with Bethesda (I will hold back my thoughts about their methods ) So, get the game, get the patch(s).

Thanks much TM - I know those things aren't the problem, but they're very good advice! But what you said about the patches - after fighting NWN2 without them, guess I will just wait and see if a gold version comes out (bound to) that is already patched before I play it. Love your hyphenated description - so true

No...I didn't miss it PDL. I was just saying I could use the soul trap instead, since I don't have a lot of money. It wouldn't cost me anything but a few cuts and bruises.

I don't have a problem with that. I've played Grand Theft Auto

Nickie, here's something I found on another forum that may help you:

....or maybe you could try booting in safe mode and see if it'll install that way.

that comment was more to trail mystic, who mostly repeated that quote. but as long as ya saw at least one of us use it, it is fine.

hey what do you know, i've posted a short post.

Being a software and business systems analyst, reiteration is in my blood. That's one of the reasons I have such issues with companies that release games with a ton of bugs.... And now back to our regularly scheduled topic...

i mostly just copy myself, partly due to having speech problems early on, and also likely a bit due to my asbergers too.

but hey call it reiteration, makes me sounds more official.

Hi,

The Oblivion gates will keep popping up until you take care of the Big Siege Machine in Bruma with all of the help you got from other towns.

The more you do on the main quest the more Oblivion gates show up.

Besides....it is fun trying to figure out which way to go to get to the Sigil Stone and every Oblivion gate is different.

The Sigil Stone is always located in the tower with the fire shooting up but the path to get to it is different.

The Oblivion gates that you close will NOT reopen again. New ones will however pop up somewhere else.

You can close them anytime you feel like it...or not at all.

You will have to close the ones that are near the towns before they come to help however.

Yeah, I've noticed that some of the gates are a lot easier to close than others. The one near Chorrol for example, was very hard to get to the Sigil Stone. There were three of those very powerful "wizard" looking guys in the room with the stone. I just had to run from them and get to the stone and close the gate. There was NO WAY I could defeat them all. That was before I learned how to enchant my weapons. I probably could have taken them all down had I known about using the Stones to charge my weapons.

Anyway, my fighting skills have improved a whole lot since I've figured out more about how to use items and spells to increase my powers.

I still have a lot to learn, but the more I play, the more I get the hang of it. The tips you all have given me have helped tremendously also.

**edit**

It's just occured to me that I've totally hijacked Nipomo's thread . I'm sorry about that Nipomo. If I have anymore questions, I suppose I should just start another topic.

as long as your quests are related to the topic ya fine as far as i'm aware.

i never really had trouble with killing creatures unless there are more then half a dozen, and even then i often beat them.

and yeah the guys in the armor are types of daedra, both the fighters and the mystics. there is also a book 'varieties of daedra' i believe it is called, it lists the types and how powerful they are relative to each other. though some don't come along till you become more powerful, but by then you can still hold your own at least one-on-one.

Go for it Robert. (Seems like no one maxed out thier Atributes so they can't tell me if you have less than 3 atributes left to raise "its all over baby" (not the game, but raising atributes) or can you raise say just luck until you run out of major skills for leveling.)

I just like a little chat about oblivion so please take the thread and run with it.

By the by, save before you pick up those sigil stones in the Oblilvion Gates. As you level up, they get better and better, and if you don't get one you like, just reload and see what pops up next. Very useful for enchantments.

Good tip Hagatha. I hadn't thought of that. Though I have noticed when I die and reload a save, the chests and those Daedra Heart thingys etc. have different items in them than before.

yeah those are randomly placed based on your level. higher the level the better the stuff.

and seems i'm the only other one close to maxing all attributes nipper. but i've been taking a break past few days, and you seem closer then me. but one us us bound to hit it at some point. can see who makes it first then figure what is the case.

i might go back for those last 2-3 side quests i never did as they unrelated to anyone. gives me something to built up levels with. my problem though is that in the main char's case it'll only go up like a point per level, and he set with all the most used skills, which level ups happen too often to really level properly. might have to start gaining influence with people for the heck of it, if i can find some i haven't already got too much influence with.

I am playing slow too...taxes (!) and work (!).

I'm working my way through the fighters guild. Its fun--they are very cranky and want to hang out with you alot, either you are baby sitting them on a mission or they are baby sitting you.

I keep telling them, what is it about "SNEAK" that you don't understand.
Me: OK there's a big one, lets try to get some 3X damage on it first.
Fighters Guild mohawk guy: Blank stare, pulls out his sword and runs pell mell to attack, I swear, the biggest Ogre in the known world.
Me: Running lamely behind.."all right, all right we'll try plan B".
Plan B always causes me a lot of grief trying to save that mohawk guys bacon.

Cheers to all playing Oblivion

Nipomo, you are so funny! I can just picture that!

Yea, that is one of the draw backs of the Oblivion AI. None of the characters that accompany you emulate your current mode. They just go running head long into battle. Seems to be a common theme in a couple other RPG's.

I think the funniest incidents happen with the knights you come across inside one of the Oblivion gates. The first time I came across them and we encountered Daedra the lead guy yelled "You'll never take me down!!!" and they all proceeded to do a great impression of lemmings into a river of molten lava. I just sat there laughing and thinking "World's-shortest-military-career-ever!"

Can you not tell the mohawk guy to "stay here"? That's what I do in other games that have dumb AI like that. If the character I'm supposed to be protecting keeps doing something to get themseleves killed, just make them wait with their nose stuck in a corner somewhere until you need them.

**edit**

I had to do that with the Rainbow Six games and SWAT. The "morons" I liked to call them... would just charge in full steam ahead and get themselves killed most of the time.

laughs another hour at the 'shortest career ever' before speaking.

mostly i say they dumb enough to charge em, stay in sneak mode and just follow them at your own pace.

however i did notice once that in the shivering isles at least one guy went sneak when i did. but that was only at the first real quest to get past the gates.

Hey Nipomo,

Well, all your talk about attributes and such inspired me to spark up a new game of Oblivion. I'm playing this one a bit different to see how I can mess with the attributes and character leveling. I've started with an Imperial, used the sign of the Warrior (strength and Endurance increase)and selected Battlemage as class.

In the Battlemage class all but I think two (Blade and Blunt) of the major skills that lead to leveling are magic based. During game play I'm almost exclusively concentrating on developing my Minor Skills to prevent quick level increase. The only exception to this is Alchemy, which is just a requirement as far as I'm concerned since it's such an easy way to make quick money and buff your character.

So far it's been interesting. The game AI seems to perceive the attempt at level suppression, because shortly after significant level increases in my minor skills I was attacked by a literal barrage of enemies as follows:

6 Wolves - one pair and then four at once.
6 Bandits - One single, one pair and then a group of three.
3 Imps - one single then a pair from either side.
2 Goblin Berserkers. I usually don't come across those on the road until level 2 or 3.

These happened one right after the other down a short stretch of road on the way to Leyawin(sp) about 3/4's the way from the Imperial City. I have never encountered that much resistance at Level 1. Also, the Kajitts with their battle axes HAD to have strength levels at least in the high 60's because each swipe knocked my health points down by at least 10-15 points!

It was a ton of fun, but very intense. I get the feeling it's the developers way of saying "Level-Up or else!!" Either that or the A/I program has developed a personality

It's given the game a bit of a new life, because even though my skill stats are getting higher my health, magicaka and fatigue are still quite low adding a new challenge to the game.

that or the game is trying to tell you that you are playing the game too much.

It's interesting. I'll have to check the Elder Scrolls forums, but I think the bandits Main levels increase as your skill levels increase not just your main character levels. I just turned level two, but my skill levels for combat are right around high Apprentice level or so or about 25-35+ points. All the bandits I'm coming across hit much harder than I remember. I also noticed that the weapons and armor are starting to change over just like they do as your character levels... I was in the iron phase for some time, but the switch from steel to silver to fine steel seem to happen much quicker this time around... I really have to stop applying my analytical skills to game playing!!!

I just loaded up Oblivion again, too. I meant to play Shivering Isles but I am enjoying myself so much in Oblivion that Shvering Isles is put on the back burner for a while. I'm also not trying to level up fast. I have decided not to go to Kvatch to further the main quest. I don't want to deal with the Oblivion gates opening and it seems to me that the other critters aren't leveling as much because of that. I've decided to do all the thieves quests so I don't get overburdened with my stolen items. I'm having fun just walking everywhere and the caves and ruins don't seem as hard as the first time I played. The only time I'm using fast travel is to unload my loot at the market place then I fast travel back to the last cave or ruin I was at and continue walking on my merry way. I'm taking training lessons only in my minor skills and also in armorer (so I can eventually repair my enchanted stuff) and in mercantile since noone likes me too much yet.

That sounds good Rowen. It's always been my advice to people who play Oblivion to not even go to Jaufree and forget about the main quest for awhile. Better to pursue the misc. or guild quests first.

I'm about to infiltrate the blackwood company and so am just about at the end of the fighters guild quest.

I really enjoyed the quest where you save the daughter of the orc that spoke so funny and used all the wrong words. I liked that his house was out in the wilds and that the inside of it was done so well. I think someone must have really enjoyed creating that quest.

They should make a mod that causes orcs of the opposite sex to your character occasionally and randomly come up and give you a big hug and a kiss. Its so out of character but those faces just crack me up and it seems like a waste not to have them do something a little silly. They could say something like "Sorry, but I just find you irresistible" or talk about one of your high stats "Sorry but Sneaky Nords just make me lose my head".

Now that I write this I realize its not PC or respectful at all BUT I do get such a kick out of the mouth full of teeth those orcs have.

Maybe they could just chew on your finger or something. "Sorry, My teeth got ahead of my brain, please accept this band aid with my apologies"

I better stop, I'm just digging myself into a bigger hole. I do like thier teeth and funny cute ugly faces.

speak to the orc smith in bliss on the shivering isles as a male.

I wouldn't worry too much. We're all far too busy, sneaking and stealing and murdering and romancing and saving the universe and creating mayhem, to be worried about being PC.

There are romances in Shivering Isles? That's something new to the series...can't imagine how they implemented it, though.

No romances in Oblivion -- but in many RPG's there are -- a general comment on how difficult it is to be absolutely politically correct in action/RPG's -- when one is, say, gunning down endangered species in a game such as Tomb Raider, for instance, or choosing the path of an assassin. 'Tis why they call it the Dark Side, non?

shivering isles has some interesting options for alternate 'relationships'. you can't take advantage of any of them, but if they wanted to include the options...

the owner of 'books of bliss', the orc smith of bliss, cutter in crucible, and the like could be atypical matches for the more disturbed, amoral, and such.

though maybe just me but the games i've played mostly goes with no love interests at all, or set up the classics where ya can tell after first meeting they'll be together.
i'd like to see a game where you can have options and pick the one you want, that is touched on to a point in the kotor games, but those kinda anti-climatic, at least in kotor2.

That is why Baldur's Gate is so good. I think the romances there are pretty well-written, and there are also a ton of mods for it...

I thought the KotOR 1 was written pretty well, but the second one was, as you say, extremely anti-climatic. The whole ending was, really.

granted i only ever got the romance with bastila to work, however juhani is said to be an option, but that one never really goes anywhere and really ya barely even notice she is a choice unlike bastila. so juhani is anti-climatic to me, and with kotor1 you don't really have a choice per say.

In Kotor 1 you can play as a woman and romance Carth, which is always an option. Carth is kind of sweet.

i know, just never got things to go with him. point is though ya have 2 options, one isn't really worth it due to how anti-climatic it is.

kotor2 pretty much all of em are anti-climatic.

i have played both kotor games as male and female cause i like the story arcs.

I must say I really like the dark side-ending a whole lot more. It seems wrong for such a dark game to have such a happy ending as the light side ending...especially with the real threat beyond the outer rim looming.

my problem with it was that you had all this build up, and though the hawk is shown moving to presumably join revan, it just seems like a nothing ending for all the build up. i think i read that originally there was set a different light side ending but the rush resulted in the ending being removed which really is a let down if true. but this is going by my memory which isn't the most reliable.

i get the ending and all, it is just anti-climatic cause it is like having a huge, spectacular fireworks show, then suddenly the fireworks stops and some guy comes on a p.a. saying in the most boring, slow monotone, "thank you for coming." while you are sitting there tunned and checking your watch to see if the event is really over.