Covid 19 - Pandemic thread Part 2

Also known as Where's the toilet paper? (In my area, I still can't wait for Charmin Ultra Soft to return.

Feel free to continue on...it's Mixed Bags, so there isn't any "off-topic" rules!

"It uses up a lot of bandwidth to open a thread. The longer the thread, the more bandwidth we use. Unfortunately, there is no income generated on the site so it's all funded by MaG. I kept thinking this thread would die on it's own so I kept waiting. " (Ana's post carried over from the previous thread.)

Thanks Ana. I guess I'm not really asking for further explanation. I just don't get why keeping a long thread open is worse than closing it and opening a new thread. Consider that a rhetorical question.

Please send love to MaG!

Like Hagatha, I like to hear how people are doing through all this also though it did seem the thread was dying out.

I agree, oldbroad. I've enjoyed seeing how people were coping in different parts of the US and the rest of the world.

We watched a soccer match this afternoon (MCI vs Arsenal) where there were no fans in the stands. Fan roaring and singing recorded from previous matches was playing constantly, on the TV at least, but it was mighty strange to see nobody there but the players. A completely empty stadium. There was one big screen with some fans cheering on Zoom or Skype, piped in from their homes.

The way of the future, I wonder?

Zoom just isn't the same. Will be awesome when people can gather again together without worry.

So, in answer to the longer creating more bandwidth need vs shorter thread/topic question: This is a poor comparison, but the best I can think of at the moment. Imagine having a bunch of shoe boxes in a closet with each one containing different parts of a coin collection. If most of those boxes had, say 10 to 20 coins it would be easy to pull them out and take a look at what's inside. If one of the boxes had a couple hundred coins in it, that would not only be more difficult to move around, it would also take more effort to sort through what's in the box.

So bringing it back to the forum, when you open a small thread, it's easy to retrieve and organize the limited number of responses it contains. In a huge thread, the server is pulling in all the response you see on the page you requested, but also pieces of all the other pages and responses. It puts that much more strain on the server to handle a big thread every time someone opens it. Hope that helps

Thanks Trail! That does help some .

Nice analogy, Trail! Much appreciated.

I like that analogy too! I had no idea how to explain it!

The Governor of California has made wearing a mask in public mandatory statewide as of today.

It will be interesting to see during my next trip to the store how many people are abiding by this. I never stopped wearing one, but today I went out and saw plenty of people not wearing one. While our county still has a relatively small number of cases compared to some, the numbers in my county are growing by leaps and bounds. Definitely getting worse.

We always wear our masks, but I'd say most are not wearing them here in Missouri. If you hadn't read about the incident in Springfield, MO where two hair stylists at a Great Clips salon exposed 140 people when they worked in spite of having symptoms. But both they and their customers were required to wear masks and not a single customer got sick.

https://fox4kc.com/news/health-offi...vent-infections-at-missouri-great-clips/

Me when I go shopping

https://cdn11.bigcommerce.com/s-3nv...-Training-Suit__75140.1537533327.jpg?c=2

I don't believe they've lifted the mask order here in Illinois but it seems some of the officials are not wearing them as much anymore (mayor and governor). I have still to put one on and go someplace. I hope I can handle it when I do. I do not like stuff on my face. Never could wear a scarf like that. The only two places I want to go are to the bank and maybe to get a haircut. Unfortunately, the lobby of my bank is not open and I don't know when it plans to reopen. I'm even getting worried it may not as it is not a really busy bank (this branch). As far as my hair, the place I used to go had closed and the last two times I went to this other place that I am not sure I trust right now. If I had a better pair of scissors I would just chop it off myself!

Thanks, Trail! I too was at a loss as to how to put it in words! I appreciate you!

Mask-wearing seems to be about 60-40 here, with more women wearing masks than men. I sometimes forget and have to go running back to my car, but I do try to make sure I've got my mask on if I'm going into a store. It makes sense to me.

That's why I said to consider it a rhetorical question. I didn't think I'd understand the answer but analogies are almost always helpful .

The grocery store here in Groveland, Ca starting tomorrow will not let you in without a mask

On Tuesday I took my sister for her 3-month checkup (stretched to 5 months). Masks are required here in NJ, but I did feel sorry for our doctor who was wearing a medical-grade mask, gloves, and a plastic long-sleeved gown. Your yellow-suited guy reminded me of him, Trail.

Regarding shaggy hair, I'm just letting it grow out as I have many times over the years. As long as it doesn't frighten the dogs, I'm not going to worry about it.

Most folks in our area (Al) are not wearing masks. I don't wear one when I run, and I don't leave the house otherwise except to go to the vet. Son and husband wear masks when they go to the store and hubby has to wear one at work.

Tis a crazy time. I cringe whenever I hear someone saying it is "no big deal to get Covid" as middle son caught it early, was extremely ill and now has ongoing lung damage.

looney, I hope your son will be alright. There was a woman here in Chicago who received a double lung transplant and they showed a picture of her damaged lung. It was quite gross.

That's about 60 miles away from where I live. I wish all stores would enforce that.

L4L, I am so very sorry to hear about your son's lung damage.

A former coworker and close friend has worked all year to get staff signatures on a gift she got for me when I retired last year. She is the one person I know who got and survived the virus. She asked me the other day if she could come by to drop it off. At first I was looking forward to seeing her, then remembered I had a doc appt the following day, so asked her to just leave it outside my front door and we'd have to limit our visit to waving. I didn't want to have to tell the doc I'd known and been in contact with someone who had the virus. As it happened, she wasn't able to deliver the gift. But I was so sad I wouldn't be able to spend quality time with her.

Wearing a mask and seeing the garb doctors are wearing, as well as the routine of waiting in the car till you're called then getting our temp taken before visiting the doc; whole thing is infuriating and frustrating.

My two nurse friends, one of whom works in the COVID ICU ward would also disagree with anyone who says getting it is no big deal. She told me she's never seen anything like it. One of her patients was a 19 year old with zero underlying conditions and after 6 weeks, he didn't make it. Just heartbreaking.

I'm terribly sorry to hear this. I guess many people don't understand that surviving COVID doesn't necessarily mean a full recovery. Lung damage of any kind is no joke.

Governor of California came out yesterday stating everyone MUST wear a mask!

I always wear a mask now when I go to the grocery store and I noticed that at least 80% of the people at the local Walmart are wearing one. I had to buy some chocolate milk for my grandson this morning (babysitting) so I left at 730 this morning and I was in a hurry so I didn't brush my teeth first - and I thought - good thing for the mask. haha. Course, then I had to smell myself at the store, which wasn't pretty. We went to a restaurant yesterday for the first time and all the wait staff had their masks on. I have noticed that everyone now has salt and pepper in the little packs so they don't have to wipe off the shakers.

Thanks guys. Talked more with son yesterday and he said they are also going to do some heart tests as apparently this can damage the heart, as well as looking at the possiblity of blood clots. The weird thing is he hiked in the mountains with No ill effects, yet walking in his neighborhood, his oxygen drops dramatically. I'm glad they are trying to figure it out, and there is always hope it will resolve.

I will continue to try to avoid everyone, though I do have to go to the doc on Tuesday. Wonder if she can see me in a hazmat suit?

I'm so glad they are trying to figure this out for your son. I know this virus is causing blood clots in younger people, so hopefully it isn't something like that.

Very sorry to hear about your Son, looney4labs. I do hope he will improve soon

[Good to know that more and more research is being undertaken all the time - which is absolutely vital.]

L4L, I didn't catch that about your son. We'll definitely be keeping him and your family in our thoughts.


TM

Thanks, guys!

Wishing all the best for your son looney4labs.

Prayers and positive thoughts for your son, L4L!

Ana

baldinos giant jersey subs, people do not wear masks, but 2 people, as the grocery store, i hope l4l your son gets better, prayer and positive on the way.

Thanks, guys, much appreciated. He feels okay but he really does miss his runs.

L4L, I hope his condition is fully diagnosed and he can get back to his life.

Stay safe, everyone. This isn't over yet.

No, it's not, hagatha. Alabama is one of those states where it is going up and up.

I did go out today as I had a doctor's appt, but other than going outside to run, I'm home! Course, that's pretty much how I lived before Covid, so not that big a difference for me

I laugh at myself because I'm actually getting to stay home more which is the way I prefer it! Must be becoming a hermit in my old age! Just got home from the grocery store. I'd say about 1/4 of the people in there had masks on. More than I expected, even though we are a small town.

What about the increase in fireworks this year? Are any of you experiencing that? It has been driving my brother and me crazy (and our cats)! A local paper today said that complaints have increased this year more than 736% in Chicago. I asked a friend in Indiana if they are having this problem and she said no, but sent a CNN article about it which mentioned several states having the same issue.

So far, not here. But then we're out here in the country. Gads, I would hate to have my stinky 100+ pound Bloodhound in the house for 2 weeks!

I heard about that on the news this morning So far we are ok. I've grown to hate the 4th as the folks next door set them off for several days before and several days after and always late at night. Our little town doesn't have a fireworks law, so there is nothing I can do. Lil Soot hates them!

looney, we have been dealing with fireworks all year but June has gotten really bad. My brother had been wondering if it was just our neighborhood so it was actually good to see that it is city and nationwide. Fireworks are illegal here in Illinois but are bought in neighboring Indiana and Wisconsin and nobody gets arrested for them as far as I know. Maybe if they are caught selling them or something.

Yes, it has been a problem in NJ and NY, despite laws against private fireworks displays. People just buy up big lots over in Pennsylvania and bring them across the borders to sell them. The night before last in a city in northern NJ a toddler was burned when a round went into his bedroom through an open window. Evidentally, groups of kids think it's fun to aim the rockets at each other. We have a family over on the next street who set them off frequently, usually around midnight. Fortunately, neither of my dogs are afraid of them, but they will bark when we have the windows open. A couple of times they were so loud I nearly jumped out of my chair.

The regulation here in Wisconsin is that you do need a permit to light-off anything that explodes or leaves the ground. That includes firecrakers, bottle rockets and mortars.

You also need a permit to purchase those, so the issue is partially with the sellers illegally selling those types of fireworks to non-permited individuals and the individuals who know that it is against the law, but purchase and use anyway.

We have land in northern Wisconsin in one of the National forests. I used to get pretty irate with neighboring vacationers lighting off mortars and bottle rockets which they had no control over given the danger of fire. One neighbor laughed at me, then karma caught up with them. They ended up setting fire to one of the lots across the street requiring the Forest Service water truck to come and get it under control. They were heavily fined, had certain privileges revoked and never lit off anything bigger than a firecraker after that.

I love karma!

Sorry Trail for including Wisconsin in my post if that information was not correct. That is something I read, but mostly I have only actually heard of people going to Indiana where (I believe) fireworks are legal.

Fire is definitely a concern of mine as the houses here are quite close and people are setting these things off on the streets in front, or in the alleys out back, and sometimes in their yards. We really don't care for the noise all night, every night either. Then, just when it seems to be over at around 1 or 2 a.m., there goes one of those really loud boomers!

No prob Oldbroad. I wish they would crack down on them here. I've got no doubt that some are coming from our state, because the sellers aren't checked by authorities as much as they should be. I was just pointing out they are a problem here too. There's a place that's right on National Forest land, brazenly called Black Cat, the name of a popular brand of firework, that will sell anything to anybody. I really don't get why someone doesn't crack down on it. Just boggles me.

Oh, wow. We do have fireworks here but only on certain holidays. And given how bad our fire seasons have been in the last few years, I'm glad about that. People throwing cigarettes out the window are enough of a problem. You can track the forest fires that start right beside highways all over BC. What is it that people can't understand?

We have also become hermits, though it's almost by choice now. Tomorrow we'll be hosting lunch and soccer for one person that we've included in our little social bubble of about six people in the neighbourhood, but most of the time we're just happy to hang out together. I'm almost starting to feel like our old normal lives were just a dream. There is such an air of unreality about this time. So strange.

I'm not a big fan of fireworks. Been there, done that, no surprises anymore. My dog hates the noise more than I do. Years ago, when I was married, there were always a few people in the neighborhood who would pop off a few noisemakers almost every night during the summer. One in particular was consistent. Everything would be quiet around 9:30 or 10 at night, then 'boom!', really spooked me. One night, my then husband took our dog for an extra 'walk' and found the house that was doing it. Stood by it and called the police. The owner was ticketed, which only stopped it temporarily. Thank goodness, it's not quite as bad where I live now.

This year in particular I wouldn't trust going anywhere near where fireworks are happening. People are going to use them to let off emotional steam. Too scary for me.

I'd like to bring up another issue that I find interesting and just plain stupid. The 2020 Census. Seems to me it's rather pointless doing that while thousands of people are dying. I just don't get it.

The Census is mandated by the Constitution. A Census must be taken every 10 years to count people living in the US - both citizens and non-citizens . An accurate count is required by law.

I looked it up because I wasn't sure either.

I believe the census was actually mailed out before we were aware of all this Coronavirus stuff and the effects it was going to have.

I remember getting the census and filling it out online before we went into lockdown and before Covid was a thing.

Butterflybabe, now more than ever is census data important. It decides where funding needs to go and allows public funding for healthcare to be distributed in most needed areas.

Me too Marian (although I mailed mine in) and if other people did the same, the information is now skewed (if that's the right word). I think that might be Butterflybabe's point.

No, Ana is correct. Now more than ever the census data is important.

Yes, Ana is correct and I'm aware of the reason for the census and that it's mandated by the constitution, but oldbroad gets my point. The way I think of it, 2 million citizens send in their info/data, within the following month 20,000 die from covid. Doesn't that mean that a lot of that reported data changes? Maybe I'm oversimplifying it, but I just don't understand how the data can be trusted to be accurate with so many changes happening right now. The number of people and their needs are changing more rapidly than has happened for a long time, if ever.

I don't remember ever getting something in the mail about it either. First learned about it from Local library send out a notice that their computers were available for people to use to complete it online. Village were I live also sent out a notice that if a resident didn't complete it, a village official would contact that person to remind them. When I went online, the site asked for a number, which I didn't have, but site is designed to account for that. I was done in 10 seconds. I've heard very little else about it anywhere, esp on the news.

I also feel the date will now be inaccurate but the Census was sent out in the mail before this all happened. Who could have known? And while I know this is supposed to be every 10 years, I only remember doing this 3 times and I'm 62??? Seems more like every 20 years only.

Well, when you think about it though, the census is basically a snapshot in time. People are going to die in the weeks and months after completing it with or without a pandemic. Statisticians take that into account. That's probably why we wait 10 years between snapshots. In that period we would realize the overall major shifts in population...people moving into and out of states and regions are the main reasons, as well as demographics. Deaths are going to occur everywhere and it's likely assumed it's proportional to population.

You know what's weird and probably sounds stupid? I actually wrote on the census where it asked about address as of April 1st (or something like that), I wrote next to my answer "if I'm still alive", because, hey, you never know, and that was a couple weeks into my future.

So, I won't get into the math, but there are specific techniques used to take into account the range of variance due to events or whatever, that are built into their data analysis.

Gathering and leveraging the data are two very different things, and those who use it for reporting are aware of the circumstances.

They never use straight counts, it's always subject to analysis. A simplified example would be something like removing outliers from a dataset. There are lots of other things they can do to balance the results, like Predictive Analytics that would give a more accurate view.

Thanks for that, Trail. I always wondered how they actually made use of the data. Between seasonal flu, vehicle accidents, cancer, old age etc, there are hundreds of thousands of deaths every year and I've wondered the same thing.

I just found a site called 'census data', and found a chart showing all sorts of percentage data done in 2019 covering the population dating back to 2014. At least I think that's what I saw. Very interesting. Info on all sorts of stuff.

Over at census.gov they've got a bunch of info on how they calculate and use the data. Their "Census Academy" has some good info.

Oh, jeez... we are starting to have COVID cases spike in our county, which was to be expected with the lackadaisical approach of our governor on reopening. Our town is very small, but two local restaurants are closing completely - no curb service, no nothing - for a minimum of 2 weeks. One had an employee in the kitchen test positive and other is closing out of an abundance of caution. I have a feeling there will be more closings to follow.

Yes, Drac. That seems to be happening in a lot of places right now. This is actually starting to feel more scary to me now. Before, you could feel there was an end in sight somewhere, but now it is starting to feel like, maybe not. I'm starting to imagine a really weird future.

I have felt very wary since news of relaxations to "Lockdown" was first announced. Too many and too soon for my liking ....

We had a spontaneous neighborhood (cul-de-sac) BBQ on Sat evening under a couple of trees. All of us were mindful of sitting away from each other; usually all gathered near food table. It was fun, but weird. Talked about how eerie to find everybody's car at home during the beginning of the shutdown. Some women shared about not going for a haircut in way longer time than usual. Who's working and who isn't. We normally have this gathering around Labor Day but who knows what the state of things will be at that point. Fireworks weren't quite as extensive as usual, just enough to make my dog shiver.

The trick of this virus is, no matter how frustrating it is, we can't get complacent about it, that's when things get bad again.

That actually sounds kind of nice butterflybabe!

It is Draclvr. It was a new experience for me when I first moved here in 2013. It is a cul-de-sac in back of a community center building. Most people don't know it exists unless you are visiting, checking out a place for sale or take a wrong turn. Sad part is that about 20 people live in this small area, but people from only 5 houses typically show up. Don't know why. It's good for me because those who show up live near my own home and I've gotten to know them pretty well. Very helpful and kind people. I always bring my dog and they give him lots of cuddly attention until he gets annoying. At this past party, one of the neighbors went to his house. Minute he left, my dog jumped up and sat in his chair. We all laughed. When the guy came back, laughed and pushed him off. Close friends who knew me, esp after my divorce, were happy I found the place because the area is quiet, well kept and safe.

We have had a big spike in our county in California as well as many other counties in the state. Indoor dining has been shut down again here after having reopened. I canceled a cleaning appointment at the dentist that was for this morning because the Covid situation here is worse now than it was two to three months ago. I did not want to cancel the appointment but felt that I should nevertheless. The dentist and the hygienists come from areas that are actually worse than ours in terms of the numbers.

I find myself wondering how long before I feel like it's safe to go back to the dentist? All of our doctor's appointments have been over the phone, and still are. I don't like going too long without a visit to the dentist, but it just didn't feel right to me. I changed the appointment to the end of August, but who knows what the status of things will be then. I have a feeling it might well be worse.

These are very strange times in which to live.

Here, the news lately is about reopening the schools. I was just telling my brother that I don't even know why they are discussing it right now (the dates). Yes, they need to have a plan for when they do reopen, but normal time to open is over a month away still. Who knows what will be happening then.

I took my first trip out today in 5 months. My brother took me to the drive through at the bank and I finally got to wear my mask.

Five months is a really good run, oldbroad. I'm kind of a hermit when given the opportunity, so that sounds good to me.

We don't have the option of going to the dentist... my appointment was canceled long ago and they are only doing emergency's

Yes, that was the case here for a good while, Winfrey. I am surprised they are doing appointments here now for anything other than emergencies.

Yeah, cancelled my dental appointment too. I will just have to take extra care of my teeth for awhile.

I spent last Monday night in the hospital and was nervous the whole time. Appears I have another blood clot and tiny little pieces have been traveling to my lungs over the last several weeks. So, I'm back on a blood thinner forever. I feel fine and was going nuts when they made me stay several extra hours to take my next blood thinner dose... no option to take it home with me! I made a deal with the hospitalist - disconnect me from all these heart monitor leads so I can get dressed and go walking and I'll stay until 4:00! She said OK and the third time I went trucking by the nurses station at a pretty good clip, they laughed at me and said it sure appeared I wasn't having any trouble breathing! I just hated being there because I know there are a lot of COVID patients there too and who knows what else. Couldn't wait to get home to my little sanctuary and my 114 tomato plants!

Sorry to read this, Drac ! Glad it was a quick stay. This is definitely of the time to be in the hospital. Hope your feeling better.

Drac, I am so sorry to hear this! Sending positive thoughts your way!

Well, it's good they caught it Drac, and I'm glad you're back. We'll keep you in our thoughts as well. Care to send a few tomatoes up our way?

TM

Hi Draclvr, Sending positive thoughts your way! And I hope you stay healthy to enjoy your tomato plants.

Take care of yourself Draclvr. I hope they got the dosage right so you don't need to go back there and you get yourself better.

Drac, I too am sorry to hear about this! Here's to staying healthy and out of the hospital.

Thank you, everyone! Saw my primary care doctor yesterday and he just shakes his head at me. After yet ANOTHER thorough exam, I have no restrictions and can go back to normal. Just have to be careful with the blood thinner.

You don't even get into this doctor's building without a temperature check and you must wear a mask and use hand sanitizer before you enter. There is a Safety Office at each entrance to enforce it. If you don't have a mask, they have a pile of them and will give you one. It was the same at every entrance to the hospital and especially the ER. While I was waiting for my appointment yesterday, I saw a Safety Officer walking around making sure everyone was keeping their mask on. It's good to know at least the medical community understands this thing and is taking it seriously.

At my hospital things are going back to relatively normai. All our outpatient departments are open. Only 1 person without a family member or friend unless needed (kids, etc). Our blood sampling department is only open to patients from our own specialists. The gp blood sampling department is now appointment only (they are located all over our province). Hand disinfection is required, masks only when keeping 1.5 meters is not possible.

My dentist is back to work since earlier this month. Masked. We can visit museums (distance plus hand disinfection).
Slowly things are going back to a new normal.

Jarkeld, that is such good news for your country!

Not a very pleasant experience for you, Draclvr ....

Hope you keep safe and well now and can stay at home !!!!

We are keeping a close eye on things. Can't let this kind of pandemic surprise us again.

Draclvr: Hope you are feeling better. Thrombosis is definately not fun. Which type/brand of blood thinner did they prescribe?

This time I'm on Xareleto. I had a PE in 2016 too, but that time they attributed part of the reason for the DVTs to a 11 cm ovarian tumor! It was benign, but was wreaking havoc. That time I was on Eliquis for 3 years. It's very hard to get these drugs even if prescribed by a doctor. Then have to jump through all kinds of hoops with insurance companies... it's disgraceful, but that's our medical system.

Unbelievable that it's so hard to get those drugs. Over here the insurance companies pay up when the doctor prescribes them.
I had 2 dvt's, left lower leg in 2013, 6 months of coumarins (acenocoumarol), got a second DVT in 2015 (right lower and upper leg) and have been on fenprocoumon ever since. My hematologist reckons a third event would be very likely and probably big enough to get a PE so he recommended that i should take them for the rest of my life.

Sometimes the cause is difficult to find (got a few risk factors including heterozygous Factor V Leiden (found it a few years before when using my own blood for testing a new machine) but nothing definitive, no further testing was performed) but a tumor is quite a risk factor. Luckily they found it and removed it. Even benign tumors can be very dangerous.

Yes and in 2016 my doctor sent bloodwork up to the Mayo Clinic - considered a world class research facility - to check for things like heterozygous Factor V Leiden... everything including several hereditary factors was negative. Maybe it's in the water since I've had two PE's!

Knowing you had DVTs had to be worrying when COVID 19 was more prevalent where you are. VERY glad to hear you are doing so well now.

Here in Illinois, some things have returned to semi-normal. My dentist and acupuncturist both opened their offices after a month of being closed. Hospitals are open for 'regular' business. The college I retired from is trying to work toward opening the college building in the fall, but I just don't see it happening. My friends that have been doing their work from homes are not eager or comfortable returning there with a lot of people around. Right now, when given permission, they an go to their workspace for an hour or so to do things they can't get done at home, like finding and/or filing paperwork. So much normal work material was left behind when things shut down. They like it because they can work in peace with no interruptions.

No matter how much things try to return to normal, it wouldn't surprise me if things go back to getting shut down again before we start finding our way out of this mess. I just don't feel safe without knowing they've found a successful vaccine. If that means limiting my travel for another 6 months, I'd rather be safe than not.

I totally agree with you, butterflybabe. I don't think we'll ever go back to the way it was before and I don't look forward to how bad this is going to get before it gets better.

I think we will get back to some semblance of what it was like pre-virus, but it could take years. If things work out that a vaccine is available within the next year, it will take time for everyone to get vaccinated, and if they use an egg-base as they usually do, not everyone will be able to tolerate. It won't be safe to be in a crowded room for a long time. The health problems and deaths relating to the virus will continue for a while. It wouldn't surprise me if the life span for those who survived the virus is shortened. Makes me sad and sick that our everyday language and lives have been affected so much by this.

Covid19 being an RNA based coronavirus like SARS and some of the family of viruses that cause the common cold, can be problematic when building a preventive treatment. The main reason is the rate that those type of viruses sometimes mutate.

That said, it's not impossible because we have vaccines for a number of RNA based viruses that work great. I agree that it will take years for things to return to normal, and I wonder if they are being overly optimistic when they say we'll have an effective vaccine by winter, or by next year. That seems really hard to estimate until they truly determine that the virus mutations are relatively similar or when it turns "stable". I do have hope that they will find some sort of treatment soon due to the sheer number of resources investing time into this. I just hope they are looking outside of the vaccine box when trying to develop a preventative.

In the mean time, I also hope people finally learn to help each other as opposed to duking it out over the last roll of toilet paper. On a selfish note, I also hope the internet stays up, and that safe harbors like Gameboomers stay running through it all. Also, so I can continue to binge watch Star Trek when I get depressed

Well said, Trail

Well, hair salons were just shut down in my county again (along with some other restrictions) by order of the governor, so it looks to me like my decision to cancel my dental cleaning appointment was the right decision to make. I would be surprised if the dentists around here did not revert now to emergency visits only.

Hear, hear, Trail! The prevalent mutation right now seems to be fairly stable, but they are really worrying that it's going to stealthily mutate again.

Was talking with a friend of mine who said something that made sense to me. A vaccine will take time, the trick/hope is to find an antivirus/antidote to curb/stop the virus from affecting people who catch it. This could allow some easing of the social distancing. If you get it, a hospital can give you a 'cure'. Something has to be found to assist in this way because, from what I gather, covid is just the start of a new line of the most potential virus that we've ever faced.

I still can't believe this is happening. Who'd thought any of us would have to face something like this in our lifetimes?

Yeah, it's some crazy stuff. Reminds me of sci-fi novels I've read...


On a lighter note, you guys might be familiar with Zfrank's YouTube channel. He does those Morgan Freeman style, parody docu-vids. He did one back in April that I missed about pets in isolation, when the lockdown was going everywhere. It's pretty funny, although the last one with the dog was so cute and true it made me tear up a little.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5Ejup_nfPY

That was too cute, Trail!

My town is now a covid hotspot. 28 people have tested positive in the last few days. It started with a bar. My stepdaughter has to spend a week in quarantaine (her hairdresser tested positive), and my wife has lost her sense of taste and smell. She has an appointment to get tested on friday. Looks like the second wave is coming.

That's not good news Jarkeld. I hope all turns out well with your family and your town. My city is dialing back a little bit on their "openings". Bars had been approved for opening a couple of weeks ago but now they can only be open if they serve food and they do that outside (if I understand it correctly). I still will not go to get my hair cut, and today took some scissors to it myself but only cut the ends a little because I am not sure I can do it. Not that anybody would see it since I don't go out anywhere, but...

Oh, no, Jarkeld! I was hoping you were ahead of the game there. We are having a huge spike in my local area too, but it's still just a part of the first wave.. I just found out someone we know very, very well has tested positive. He is still home, but is very sick. He's in his late 70's, so we are all quite worried. My good thoughts are with you and your family.

Trail, speaking of sci-fi novels; I read/heard somewhere that Stephen King is spooked since he couldn't have produced a piece of fiction much better/scarier than what is happening now. It would be hard for me to be interested in reading/watching something that I've already lived thru.

Jarkeld, sending positive thoughts your family's way. So sorry to hear!

Drac, sending positive thoughts to your friends way too!

oldbroad, I only get my hair cut once a year so I'm still good for a long while.

Mine is going on 2 years now Ana. It is in my way!

Just a 'Hello' from across the pond, haven't been around for ages. Some might remember me, I feel I haven't been well for a long time. They couldn't find anything when I had tests and I kept telling them I didn't feel well at all. Then just lets say my colitis started raging. I am now on imune suppressants, life is difficult but we manage, 'carry on reguardless' chin up friends new and old. I can't believe what I hear about going on over there and I fear for my sister in Redwood City, ca. She's my little big sis, I always was bigger than her. Thinking of you all, stay strong. I'll be rooting around the forum for Ideas on a new game to play. Have to say I've had a lot of trouble with BIGFISH games of late or the download manager the customer service blames windows 10, I've tried all sorts and wondered if I should have bothered with win 10. As Felix looks down on me from the shelf by the tv in my santuary. Rather disaproving if you ask me. Love to all Johnnycowgirl

I certainly do remember you, Johnnycowgirl, and I am sorry to hear that you haven't been feeling well and that your life has had such difficulties.

I am also sorry to hear you have been having trouble with Big Fish games - I haven't had any technical problems at all with them. Don't hesitate to ask questions in our Glitches forums for any problems you might be having. It would be nice if Felix were not looking at you disapprovingly.

Good to hear from you.

You stay strong too Johnnycowgirl and on Felix.

Nice to see you, Johnnycowgirl I remember you too. Certainly hope they can figure out how to make you feel better... colitis is an awful disease. My DIL had it. I have Windows 10 and don't have any problems with Big Fish either. Please come see us in the Glitches forum and maybe we can help you!

Hey I thought Draclvr was familiar of course I love anything to do with that guy too. Good to hear from you and Marian. I see a certain Tgre is still about. And goodaye to u oldbroad. I have been with Bigfish a long time now emailed them many times over the years mainly the early days so I automaticly (spellcheck) compatability etc, I'll think about droping into hints and glitches but I have a few games on steam i am playing at the mo. I never did find my way out of the fog in Dracula 5, well [blip]!
bfn johnnycowgirl

Hi Johnnycowgirl! I remember you too and it's so nice you stopped in! So very sorry to hear about your health issues and your added difficulties with BF. I hope you can get both sorted out.

Ana

Hey, everyone. Hope you're all still safe.

We seem to have things more or less under control here in BC except for the young party-goers in places like Kelowna, which is a summer party hotspot.. Of course young people feel that they're bullet-proof. The problem is that the rest of us aren't. Also, we do have people from the US here going places they aren't supposed to. Americans are allowed to travel through BC to get to Alaska, but some people are taking side trips to Banff and Tofino, so that's a real worry because we can't control that.

We just got through a health issue with my husband that's been hard to deal with, but with an adjustment in medications he's back to his usual cheery self. We've only been able to get out in our boat a couple of times this summer because the wind has been awful, but finally we have some semblance of summer.

Stores and other businesses are now open again but with restrictions on the number of people allowed in at any time. We lost one restaurant, but unfortunately it was the only real fine dining place in town. They had only just opened last year, too. I feel terrible for the owners.

Hi hagatha. I'm glad to see you posting and that your husband is "back to his usual cheery self". I hope he stays that way!

I have been reading that the younger crowd is starting to be the ones getting hit with this thing now.

Yes, now that restrictions have been eased the college crowd seems to think life is back to normal. We're really fortunate to live on Vancouver Island -- we have our "moat."

Because of my husband's health, we still need to be very careful. We will have a few visitors from Vancouver in August for socially distanced gatherings on our deck, which is huge. We can easily have a party of six out there without getting too close. Of course they'll have to stay in hotels, but there are lots of those around here since we're tourist country.

This has been a weird year. On top of COVID, we've had no real summer weather so far. We've mostly had rain and extreme winds. Yesterday was hot and still, but it got cold again overnight and I had to get up at 4 am looking for a blanket. My tomato plants are only now starting to fruit.

2020 has just been a strange year altogether. Glad to hear hubby is back to his cheery self! It's the same here with the young people - they don't think it's going to affect them. The idiots are having COVID parties and purposely infecting themselves, taking bets on who gets it first. Two of them died... I read both their stories and it was heart-breaking. And now the number of children being hospitalized is rising in Texas. This is just a very scary virus and for those of us with issues, having to deal with the people who won't take it seriously is even more scary. I'm skipping my granddaughter's baby shower Saturday because my doctor advised me to stay away from any gatherings because I have blood clots in my lungs.

But tomatoes! Wish I could share some of mine with you, hagatha! We're getting tons and I had hubby get my nifty Italian tomato strainer out so I can start the canning!

In my own opinion, the easing of lockdowns in some locations (globally) might not be the best decision.
This virus is STILL rampant.
And common sense and regard for others needs to be HUGELY utilised

Annnddddd...we now have one case here, linked to the Kelowna parties. So that means we are now back into self-imposed lockdown, apart from grocery store trips and boating.

Yes, I've read about those parties also Draclvr. How ridiculous is that???!!!

Here in Chicago the cases are rising a little bit again with some things partially reopened. They are keeping an eye on things and have back pedaled a little already. If the rise hits a certain point, we will be shutting more things down again.

Unfortunately, our state levels are on the rise. Most counties are being classified as "High" activity level for COVID, meaning the % of those being tested is on an upswing.

My significant other and I ended up getting tested last week, because I was running a light fever and had a couple other minor symptoms the weekend before last. No idea how any virus could have penetrated our defenses, because we've been extremely cautious ( mean to the point of obsessive ) , but apparently it did. Luckily, my test came back negative and the fever has not returned since Saturday. Even so, our family MD said I should still monitor and self-isolate for 10 days, which is what I've been doing. Apparently, if your the kind of person who is very self-aware of their health like me (read as paranoid) and catch it quick, it may not show up on the first test. So far so good though, been just a little tired, which isn't anything unusual.

Well I hope you stay safe and well, Trail_Mystic

Sending positive thoughts to you Trail!

Trail, hopefully this will prove to be nothing and you'll be fine. Be well.

Sending positive vibes that all is well.

Thanks for the well wishes I'm doing good, seem like the symptoms I had are pretty much gone.

My significant other, who tested negative as well, didn't have any symptoms at all, but thought she should get tested out of an abundance of caution.

What I wonder about is what virus made it passed all our defenses (masks, disinfectant, hand wipes, hand gel, etc). Must have been a pretty durable bug. My MD thinks that it may have been just a summer cold variant that I could have had in the past, which is why my symptoms were so mild. At first I thought it was just allergies until the fever started, weird. I'm just glad that it's not covid. Honestly, I was a little terrified there for a bit.

Now I'm back to my old obnoxious self

I'd be freaked out too, TM. So glad all is okay.

Good to hear all is well Trail!

These days we're all understandably a little paranoid about even the mildest of symptoms because COVID seems to have such a wide range of effects.

Now that we know cases are rising a bit here in BC and we even have one confirmed case in our town, we've both bought face shields just in case things get bad here. You never know. And John even wore his into town today.

Mind you, he also forgot to change out of his pajama pants and flip-flops, so he must have been quite a sight in the grocery store with his face guard, t-shirt and navy PJ bottoms with stars on them. Fortunately, we do see perfectly normal looking men walking around in t-shirts and pajama bottoms in stores here, taking the notion of casual clothing to a whole new level unseen just about anywhere else in Canada. We even call our street the flannel highway because of the random pajama-wearing men around here. It's just that John doesn't do that and didn't realize he'd done it until he reached for his wallet, which of course wasn't there.

Oh dear hagatha

Men in pajamas sounds cool to me.

Hagatha, that is a great story

That's hilarious Hagatha

I empathize. Even though I get up very early, and have done so for years for my job, I've never been a morning person. Sure, I dig sunrises and a good cup of coffee, but give me an extra couple hours in the sack over either of those any day. As a result, there's been more than once my weekend, blurry-eyed attire has been less than coordinated when going out to run morning errands. Like the time I found myself wearing two different shoes....

He's getting pretty forgetful. He always was, but add in the pain meds and some of our (legally grown) medicinal herb and he can be an absolute laugh riot these days.

Um, hang on. I'll get my mis-matched shoes and be right over.

The Flannel Highway would welcome Boomers, but alas, there's that COVID thing.

And then there was the party in my county here in NJ where someone rented a mansion through Airbnb, sent out flyers on Instagram, and 700 people showed up. It took the local police 5 hours to clear out the place, and there wasn't a mask in sight. It's incidents like this that make me wonder how we have survived this long as a species.

We have the same kind of fools here, too. We had a spike in cases in British Columbia following large parties of young people in Kelowna. In fact the one case we have here in town is linked to the Kelowna outbreak.

Insane.

I came across something on-line that seemed appropriate to this conversation.

There are 2 factors that determine the extent to which COVID spreads through a region:

1. How dense the population is in the particular area
2. How dense the population is in the particular area

Yup!

Love that

Too funny. And so true.

So true

New Jersey is the densest state by population in the US. I don't think I'll mention that anymore.

I have a theory that people here on Gameboomers are weathering this storm well because we have our games and are generally speaking comfortable being by ourselves and entertaining ourselves for long stretches. Certainly that's true for me. I'm not antisocial, but I am quite content to be at home deep in a game, or a book, or one of my TV shows.

I think you are right! A lot of people never learned to entertain themselves or be comfortable alone. Gamers always know how to lose themselves in a game! I find my best days are those that I am hiking alone with my dog. I have friends I see and enjoy their company but don't find myself "lost" without them. I have sisters and friends that can't believe I'm happy to eat at home and listen to the TV (I rarely watch) and would rather do that than go out to eat and go to the theater. I like my home, my husband and my dog. My own little universe and safe space. I guess I'm an introvert.

Ana, that is how I feel too. I think gamers and readers have been training for 2020 forever.

Yep, totally with you both there. Even when I'm working I'm usually plugged into Audible. I really don't understand it when people say they are "bored". Good grief, I've got enough home projects, hobby projects, audio and real books, plus a ridiculous assortment of games I haven't played yet to keep me going until I'm 6 feet under and beyond

Not to mention our pup, who is always an adventure in something.

Exactly, Trail

L4L

Trail, there is no such thing as boredom in my world either! I have a lack of hours to do what I want!

Maybe THAT'S why I like this place so much - it is full of kindred souls!

Most definitely.

We finally have some tomatoes, only about a month later than usual.

The humpbacks are here now in numbers, and it's almost impossible to go out in the boat and not see at least one or two. We haven't been mugged yet this year -- mugging is what we call a very, very close encounter with a humpback, where they swim up to your boat and just hang out with you, and I mean close enough to reach out and give them a pat. no exaggeration. You have to turn off your engine, of course, so you don't injure them. They turn on their sides and just wave their tails to stay with you. They definitely look at you, too. They're such gentle beings that I've never been overly worried. Of course, if it's a really young one, its mother will come over and lead it away. Lots of fun.

I am not an outdoorsy type and I don't do water but the place you live at sounds so beautiful hagatha!

Hagatha, that sounds like heaven to me!!

It is heaven, and it's kept us sane through my husband's illness. The city itself has little to offer, but wilderness is our back yard.


By the way, there are online videos of humpbacks mugging boats near our city. It's quite an impressive sight.

I found this video. What a beautiful sight.

We know the fellow in this video. He actually knows all of the whales around here, though he is more of an Orca expert.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/brit...hale-watchers-on-b-c-boat-tour-1.4762696

As you can see, a humpback mugging is a fine thing, indeed!

Chiming in on the topic of boredom. I'm fine but people whose everyday lives revolved around volunteer work; community work are having a hard time adjusting to the limitations, not being able to be around a lot of people. A friend of mine just retired and is struggling with that very thing. She has cerebral palsy and, up until a month ago, worked everyday and spent her free hours doing community work. The day after she retired she shared with me that she was at a loss of what to do 'cause all the places she used to hang out in are closed. She doesn't drive and depends on others for computer stuff. I guess some people need to learn to redirect their energy.

butterflybabe, I count my blessings every day that I have MORE than enough to keep me busy. Yes, the horse rescue where I volunteer is closed to the public, but stalls still need to be cleaned and all the chickens, pigs, goats, etc. still need to be taken care of. Plus, my gardens are keeping me very busy canning tomatoes and making pickles. I know several people who are having a hard time with the boredom.

butterflybabe, my BIL lives in Chicago and volunteers 3 days a week at the foodbank. There are places everywhere in need of help if she wants to fill her time!

I think she's mostly still in shock over this change in her life. I'm sure she'll figure it out. Have to check with her on that the next time we talk.

So our cases in B.C. are on the rise again thanks to people starting to congregate in large numbers again (I'm looking at you, young people).

People just aren't realizing that this is going to be our life for quite a long time and it will be even longer if people don't step up, mask up, and act like adults. I try not to get too upset with people who are less than cautious , but my husband is at risk, and actually so am I, with my asthma.

THe big picture is not in infection rate, but how serious they are. Hospitalizations are near nothing and they are either asymptomatic or have mild symptoms. Much like a common cold virus, we may never get rid of it but we can't stop living.

More young people are catching COVID and in that group the death rate is lower, but the transmission rate remains the same. For my husband, it would be a death sentence.

Did you catch the news item about the 20,000 motorbike people in for an annual convention? Reporter talked to one of them who wasn't wearing a mask and wasn't worried cause 'it's just a form of the flu'. It's that kind of blase attitude that is almost worse then the virus itself.

My views are vastly different from everyone here, so I will bow out, but I wish everyone good health and happiness!

I think the main issue is lack of coordination when it comes to the dissemination of knowledge on the virus and its impacts

So far we know that COVID is most definitely spread through:
-Direct person to person contact
-Airborne Exposure for a period of time dependent on conditions and air circulation
-Person to surface to person contact for a limited period of time

We also know those typically at risk:
-Have pre-existing conditions (either weakened immune systems or chronic conditions that worsen with the virus symptoms such as COPD or heart/organ failure)
-Lack general good health
-The elderly. A some what overly generalized term, but I think most of us get the implications.
-Those genetically predisposed to prolonged suffering from this type of virus - This is the one that's scary, because being an RNA based virus it can impact even the healthiest person critically, dependent on factors that have yet to be identified. In other words it is "the luck of the draw".

What we don't know
- How to define "Asymptomatic" when it comes to COVID. Mainly because there are an array of symptoms that have been observed, some of which are only slight. This is why WHO re-defined what they meant about asymptomatic spread of the virus. It's simply very difficult to quantify. If you don't know that you're infected, chances are you're not going to be tested. If you contact-spread the virus, you won't necessarily show up when contact tracing is performed in an outbreak area. As a result it may appear that the spread of COVID by asymptomatic individuals could be initially rare. The important thing to note, is that being asymptomatic does not mean you can't shed the virus. If you have it, are in the process of what's known as shedding or the point when you're most contagious - You can still spread it through a sneeze or cough that might be caused by your seasonal allergies or even a little irritation caused by dust, but is no less effective in spreading it than someone with pronounced symptoms.

So, its probability: The higher the number contracting it, the more public contact, the higher the transmission rates will become, therefore the higher the probability that high risk individuals will contract it. Basically a very nasty circle.

It's actually 250,000. Yikes!

Weird times.

Trail, that's about the best description I've seen. That's why this thing is so scary for people in my age group. My grandson may not show symptoms, but he could pass it to us. And like hagatha, it would be a death sentence for us. When you have roughly between 20,000 and 30,000 die each flu season from seasonal flu and over 30,000 per MONTH die from COVID-19, it kind of tells you something about this virus that like Trail says, is a very nasty circle.

My next door neighbor is a COVID ICU nurse. She told me about holding the hand of a 37 year old wife and mother and looking into her eyes and telling her she was going to keep fighting for her as she died. No underlying conditions and she couldn't see her children or her husband. THAT'S why I will take this thing seriously.

Well, the good news is that with the plethora of medical researchers studying the virus and its impacts, they think they have at least identified what causes people to go critical so fast. Even if they don't have any known pre-existing conditions. Luckily, the Benaroya Research Institute in Seattle that specializes in autoimmune diseases joined the fight and found that the virus does cause an autoimmune response in some people; what they call a "cytokine storm".

Basically, the immune system uses a two part attack on invaders. The first part is what causes inflammation in the body. Like when you get aches and pains or swelling when you have the flu. Then another component takes over and basically tells the first wave to back-off. What appears to be happening, is that COVID prevents the "communication" between those cells in some cases, allowing that first phase to run rampant. That creates all sorts of problems from the resulting uncontrolled inflammation and related complications. So if they can catch it quick enough for people headed down that path using known therapies, they can possibly stop them from going critical. It's a step in the right direction at least.

That might also explain some of the odd, seemingly unrelated symptoms that have cropped up during and even in recovery (neurologic issues, hair loss), because autoimmune responses can really cause havoc with the body.

I have been reading about the cytokine storm response for a while now. This virus is causing the medical community to scratch their heads and come up with therapies they wouldn't normally use. The body-wide blood clots in the younger patients are something they are treating aggressively too. It's definitely not doing the things to the body that a "normal" virus such as seasonal flu does. I was also reading something about how these viruses that jump from other animals to humans makes them so hard to figure out.

The cytokine storm theory terrifies me, because I have three different autoimmune diseases already. I tend not to get sick with flu or anything else on a regular basis, but on the very rare occasion when I do get sick, it's a doozy. I'm going to have to err on the side of extreme caution if this is what's going on.

It's now thought that our second wave will be here in September, so we're planning on shutting ourselves down at the end of August and going back to staying at home except for groceries. At least we now have toilet paper, though sometimes you can't get it. People are still stocking up on it.

I admit to being a little stocked up on the toilet paper as I am worried about having trouble finding it in the not too distant future if things keep going the way they are now. As Ana said, you can't stop living, but if there are precautions you can take, why not take them? Some people just seem to be looking for trouble.

I totally agree, oldbroad. We haven't stopped living, but we have definitely adjusted our "living" to keep ourselves and others safe. The precautions are so simple I don't understand why people find it so hard to do to stop this thing. I remember my 94 year old mother telling me about all the sacrifices they had to make during WW II from gas only sold one day a week and meat only eaten one day a week and the lard and onion sandwiches - yuck! People today don't seem capable of making any sacrifices to help the country.

Oh, Drac. I’ve been making the same comparison. Women who normally were homemakers went to work in the factories amd there was ratioining of many things. You got one book of ration stamps a month amd when you ran out, you just had to make do until the next month. No frozen dinners at the atore, no restauramt carry-out or delivery. The women on the homefront had to do the shopping and the cooking, and figure out eays to stretch the ration stamps. Everyone did their part for the war effort and were proud of their accomplishments when it was over.

Because they don't work and/or make things worse.

There was a YouTube video by an immunology expert who explained why staying home was a mistake and why it would lead to people getting sick, sometimes very sick, from germs that they normally had immunity to. He explained why people needed regular re-exposure to these germs in order to maintain their immunity. So what Trail posted here was exactly what you'd expect to happen when people don't go out and try to avoid all germs --

Never mind how other health problems are ignored while over-emphasizing COVID.
Tuberculosis is expected to skyrocket in countries like India because of Tuberculosis testing centers being converted to COVID-only testing and treatment.

Jenny100, I agree with you 1000%.

Here is a great example. One of my clients daughters graduated a couple weeks ago. She attended a graduation party with only her friends that she has seen all summer and one had Covid. 15 of them caught it. They all had fevers that lasted less than 24 hours, were tired a few days and lost taste and smell. NO siblings, NO parents caught it. They are all off quarantine now and are off to college this weekend with antibodies. Pre-covid they wouldn't even have been tested. It would be called a cold or virus and not reported.
I realize some get very ill. Same thing with any virus. Some get knocked down, some bounce right back.

I'm sure we can go round and round. That is not something I care to do. I understand what both of you are saying (Jenny and Ana) but still think wearing the masks is simple enough and staying away from large crowds is too. AGAIN though, I am a homebody by nature so I understand this may be a lot easier for ME to say. If I was a person used to being out and about all the time I would maybe not be saying this.

I understand that staying home can then make things worse when you do go out because your body is no longer used to those everyday germs and I understand that many people who get this virus don't get deathly ill (that's a media thing only telling you the worst) but this thing apparently really does do some bad damage. Why not give the experts time to try to figure it out?

I admit that I do sort of feel that people are just going to have to venture out and see what happens before it runs it's course though.

oldbroad, I have no fear of it, but I respect it. I wear a mask in stores (because it's the law) . Not outdoors in nature or where not mandated. I have been to zero restaurants or large gatherings except family and we are doing the same. I see the same close friends and all our gatherings have been outside, including family. I am living my life, with a few common sense personal guidelines.

I guess here we're taking our cue from medical personnel who wear masks all day. There's got to be a reason they do that.

Also, both our doctor and oncologist have told us that masks are critical for my husband, and for me so I don't get infected and pass it on to him and our hospital is very clear about the requirement for masks if you're visiting for any reason. Obviously we follow our doctor's advice so for us it isn't a choice.

But there is still so little known about this virus it's tough to say how much we can prevent transmission via masks and distancing We do observe that when people congregate en masse without masks the outcome is a drastic increase in the number of cases a couple of weeks later. For most people it's okay, but for quite a few others there is death or permanent damage, and any time we can avoid that we should.

Personally, I am not willing to risk that for myself or my husband. I come from a family of long-lived ancestors on both sides and I fully intend to live long enough to be an argumentative old bag,

Well said, hagatha! Same here. I spent the night in the hospital a few weeks ago with another pulmonary embolism and both my personal physician and my attending physician warned me specifically about wearing a mask and not going anywhere where masks are not required. They stressed it quite strongly as being the best - if imperfect - way to prevent transmission until there is a vaccine. My doctor's building and my hospital don't allow you to even enter the premises without a mask and a temperature check. They even have a security officer walking the floors to make sure people keep them on. I had to wear a mask during my CT scan and a couple of other procedures. I don't particularly like them, but will continue to listen to my doctors as they know WAY more than I do. I also come from a line of long-lived women on both sides and plan on being here for a very long time myself. Being an argumentative old bag is just an extra plus!

Horribly obvious straight-line, must...not...comment.

Oh, c'mon, Trail! Live dangerously!

Yes, do tell , Trail...

I was just thinking that you're such a reasonable person, it would be somewhat surprising for you to turn into an argumentative old bag... Yeah, that's it.

Suuuuure, Trail... suuuuuure!

Yeah, that's the ticket.

BET, Were the parents and siblings tested? Not getting sick doesn't mean they aren't asymptomatic. It's my understanding that that's were a main concern lies. Unless a person is tested, and those tests are not being done regularly enough nor available to everyone, anyone could get asymptomatic. There is no cure for those whose bodies can't fight it off.

My bigger concern is that the death stats are not including people who have survived but now have life-altering conditions as a result.

The main one seems to be heart disease, even in some young people, but also it can affect other organs in the body including the brain. A recent study showed that the majority of survivors can have some kind of lingering condition. So just looking at the deaths doesn't really show the whole picture of the devastation this disease is causing:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/wor...ng-term-covid-19-health-issues-1.4318036

Because I know I'll end up alone at some point , I don't want to have to take care of myself hobbled by a heart condition.

There was an op-ed posted by a cardiologist this week that said myocarditis - inflammation of the heart - is showing up more and more in these "asymptomatic" and mildly symptomatic cases. A starting pitcher with the Red Sox had a mild case and was unable to pitch at training camp. Turns out he has heart damage. He also referenced that article in the Irish Times you linked to.

"An intriguing new study from Germany offers a glimpse into how SARS-CoV-2 affects the heart. Researchers studied 100 individuals, with a median age of just 49, who had recovered from Covid-19. Most were asymptomatic or had mild symptoms, while some were seriously ill. An average of two months after they received the diagnosis, the researchers performed M.R.I. scans of their hearts and made some alarming discoveries: Nearly 80 percent had persistent abnormalities and 60 percent had evidence of myocarditis. The degree of myocarditis was not explained by the severity of the initial illness." He cautions that this is an incomplete study, but that... "It makes clear that in young patients who had seemingly overcome SARS-CoV-2 it’s fairly common for the heart to be affected. We may be seeing only the beginning of the damage."

This cardiologist was currently treating a 50 year old man with zero underlying symptoms who contracted COVID. He locked himself in his room to recover, but by the time they got him to the ER, he had gallons of fluid in his legs. Not from lung involvement, but from myocarditis. He is currently being evaluated for a heart transplant.

As I've said before, this is a very scary virus... especially so for those of us for whom it would be a death sentence.

Everyone was tested. All negative except the 15 friends.

That doesn't tell me anything.
How many people who've never had COVID also have myocarditis and don't know it?

Unless you know that, you can't say COVID has anything to do with myocarditis.

If 30% of people who've never had COVID have myocarditis and 30% of people who have had COVID also have myocarditis, you can't say COVID made any difference.

It's been an ongoing investigation.

From the Harvard school of medicine back in April: https://hms.harvard.edu/news/coronavirus-heart
A formal publication from May in the National Library of Medicine: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7199677/
A more recent, but singular example from the Hartford Medical Group on Red Sox Pitcher Eduardo Rodriguez: https://hartfordhealthcaremedicalgr...-detail?articleid=25255&publicId=395

To be fair, anything that debunks or conradicts studies made by these organizations are scrubbed off the internet quicker than I can share them. There are two sides to this whole thing and one side is being kept from sharing their knowledge, studies and results.

I totally get that there are two-sides to every story and medical debate isn't exactly uncommon. There's bound to be changes in medical findings on both sides of the fence. If formal studies are being scrubbed from the Internet, the authors might want to look to where they are publishing them. If they are posting on social media as apposed to working through the usual avenues, they should probably find a more appropriate venue.

This particular issue though seems fairly logical. Viruses in general trigger our immune system, which is an immuno-response no matter how you look at it; inflammation is part of the response system. If something blocks the ability of the bodies response to back off on that particular aspect, or directly infects an internal organ (I've had personal experience with this, one reason why I'm high risk) then you're going to see issues. Both cases are quantifiable through testing. Sure, you're going to see a percentage of error caused by someone who had no clue they had a pre-existing issue, and while that may reduce the percentage of initial findings, it's not going to eliminate the cause. Actually, it's going to add to the data showing a segment of the population could be more prone to these types of impacts. You see studies adjusted all the time as the data continues to be accumulated and re-examined. That's what makes this legitimate scientific research.

Not to sound too snarky (kind of), but I mean, we have to understand that there's a very specific path to this type of research. They have very specific processes and procedures used by the many well founded and some of the most advanced medical institutions working through this. It's not a bunch of hacks, sitting around someone's living room with a child's chemistry set and a dime store microscope or some half-baked alchemists trying to turn lead to gold.

Sure, it's all a balance sheet, and we're still in the middle of the accounting, but if someone tells me a dark room I need to walk through has a floor full of broken glass, I'm gonna wear shoes when I walk through it.

Couldn't agree more, Trail. The path this virus is taking in our bodies is a constant learning process for the medical community. First they treated it as strictly an upper respiratory disease. Then the more bizarre damage started showing up - the cytokine storm, the heart damage, kidney damage, blood clots, strokes. I don't think there will be consistent medical findings and knowledge about this virus for a long time. My bottom line is that I'm going to assume my doctors know more than I do and I will listen to them, no one and nothing else. My COVID ICU nurse neighbor tells me that there is a LOT going on behind the scenes with constant changes in treatment and lots of meetings and communication within the medical community.

That's where I am. I stay home (which was my life style anyway, just more so now) and wear a mask if forced out, and severely limit who can be around me The experiences of my formerly super healthy 38 year old son who almost died from this convinced me that there would be no "almost" if I get it. I don't stay up nights terrified, but I am cautious.

I hope your son can recover from COVID completely, l4l. If I remember, you said he had significant possibly permanent lung damage.

Drac, he's had lots of tests. The good news is that there does not seem to be any heart damage, but sadly there are ongoing breathing problems. They can't find a reason for it other than Covid

i stay home with all this virus stuff going on. the only time i get out and leave the house is go to the doctor and thats a chore in its self. i have lots of problems walking up and down our out side steps. i can't wear a mask and the clinic where all our drs are gave me a face shield to use. hubby does all our shopping and even with his mask he doesn't like going any where . can't say i blame hime. hope everyone is doing well and staying as safe as they can

We stay as safe as we can. My husband is able to tolerate his chemo at 100% strength, so he's feeling pretty good these days and hanging out at home is nice.

The weather, though. It's awful. We've had no summer to speak of. Today it might as well be November. Of course, it gives me an excuse to hang out with my new laptop.

It's so weird, we've has a fairly dry and hot summer. A lot of the storms we usually get are passing either to our south or far north, that's so odd because we're in what's called Tornado alley and usually get hit with some real thunderboomers, plus the occasional twister or two. It's been quiet, too quiet as they say. Wouldn't be the first year that we got hit hard in September, but we usually get more precip by now. The grass is sure showing it. I told my partner this afternoon that I was going out to mow the dust.

That is wonderful that your husband can tolerate the chemo at full strength, hagatha! As I'm sure you well know, that's not always the case. It's nice you can stay safe from this pandemic at home where you like it, icky weather aside!

Yes, we're both pretty happy about the chemo. Because his tumour is in his lower spine, it can get painful, but the full-on chemo shuts that down nicely, and its main side effect is sleepiness. And this stuff does keep people going for a long time, even as long as 11 years and counting in the case of one fellow our GPO treats.

We just enjoy everyday. That's the main lesson we've learned. All the silly stuff becomes unimportant.

A small pod of Orca went past our windows early this morning. They had a baby. So cute.

Then life is good! Stay safe, both of you!

"A small pod of Orca went past our windows early this morning. They had a baby. So cute."

How fantastic, hagatha !! Just wonderful

Indeed. Life is good.

Hey, how many people are finding it difficult to keep off the pounds at the moment?

I hadn't realized just how much controlling my weight had to do with my normal buzzing around town just doing stuff (I'm not a fan of the gym). I'm going to have to give up my treats if I don't want to end up looking like a blimp. This is the first time I've had to consider a diet since I was in my late teens. Phooey.

It's called the COVID 30! Personally, I haven't gained any weight, but then I have so much to keep me busy outside. I know a lot of people who have though.

*Trail raises hand * Yeah and it really sucks. I was pretty much of a bean pole years ago. Then time caught up, my metabolism slowed down and the "paunch monster" attacked Part of it is working at home. Even though I'm making it a point to walk the dog and exercise, I'm actually moving less than I was at work. Part of it is because I used to walk a couple blocks to get decent coffee, used to go on regular walks while on break with my work co-horts, run up and down flights of stairs to catch meetings, travel pretty much once a month to another city on a whirlwind schedule to meet project deadlines and budgets. *sigh* you know, I used to say that I hated travelling so much. Now, if I'm being honest, I sort of miss it....

Same here. I walked a lot during the day at work just to get out. Vancouver's downtown is a food mecca, so I regularly walked for half an hour and back to get lunch, having the kind of job where being out of the office was expected. And after I retired I walked the Seawall in West Vancouver at least 4 times a week.

I guess I'll have to start putting in some hours on the trails.

I'm a hugger. The absolute hardest thing for me is not being able to hug anyone.

Hand shaking for me is hard to stop. In my job as a field inspector for the Missouri DNR I met new people every day and it was just a habit. We met our new neighbors out here in the country. The nicest young couple bought 52 acres next to us. I had to stop myself when we were introducing ourselves to each other!

Fatigue does set in, too, after a lifetime of not having to take these precautions. It's hard to maintain, especially here where we have so few cases.

After so many months, I do find myself forgetting to put on my mask when I'm going into the store. I keep a box in my car so I 'm never without, but these days I seem to be running back for one quite often. I have to be very focused on sanitizing my hands when I'm in and out of stores. Both of these things had become pretty much habit a few months back. I guess I'll have to start leaving myself sticky notes on my dashboard.

I know. I threw caution to the wind Friday night when I was so excited to see one of my favorite people at the American Legion. We drop a flat of tomatoes off for their Saturday burgers and usually socially distance at one of the tables and have a beer and go home. But I was so happy to see Mike and we got to talking music and all of a sudden I realized I was also standing next to two people who I KNOW are anti-maskers. I just forgot for about 45 minutes. We were ready to leave anyway and I so enjoyed talking to Mike, but now I feel uncomfortable because I know these two individuals have no intention of practicing anything to help stop this thing. What have they been exposed to?

I really do hate this. But I will continue to do whatever it takes to be safe. And if it's overkill, then so be it. Took my frustrations out on a giant bucket of tomatoes yesterday and brewed up 7 quarts of chili sauce!

I’m on the same page. Pretty much staying at home. Masks anytime we are out at the store. Bag on my hand when doing gas . Better safe than sorry .

Just talked to my sister up in NW Iowa. I'm from a tiny little farming town of about 1,000 people. Her best friend and her husband contracted COVID by simply going out to eat at a local steakhouse in a neighboring even tinier town of about 800 people. They had some kind of event there the week before and no one wore masks or practiced social distancing. All they did was eat dinner and leave. Her husband felt crappy, but was OK. Bonnie was taken to the hospital and then air evacuated to a larger hospital in Sioux Falls, South Dakota. She almost died and a month later cannot even walk up a flight of stairs. Her doctor told her if she caught a cold or the flu, it would kill her and she should never go anywhere without a mask and to not go to places that don't require them. My sister just missed seeing them or she would have gotten it too. She is 70 and like me has several underlying conditions and her doctor told her it would be a death sentence for her too. So she does it all, but mostly stays home with her little dog for company.

We still don't know anyone who is sick, but we're watching the news carefully.

Draclvr, I'm glad your sister has her dog for company. I don't know what we'd do without our cat.

Winfrey, I've been able to buy disposable masks on Amazon. I'm about to order more for the upcoming flu season. You might be able to get gloves, too, although I just make sure I use sanitizer liberally after getting gas.

I started working at home in November last year, and have rarely gone out since then. It was not due to any pandemic because that was before the pandemic actually hit. I was close to retirement, so my boss and I arranged to have me work at home and with reduced hours. That turned out to be a fortunate decision because I live and work in NYC, which would later be a major epicenter. If I had worked normally in the ensuing months, I would've commuted in packed trains and buses during that period and would've very likely got infected. NY Times has info on infection rate by zip code, and mine was a fairly highly infected area too.

NYC has since become a lot safer with much reduced cases and deaths. But until a vaccine is widely available (which may still be months away), I believe we should all adopt the "all bets are off" attitude. That means we should continue distancing, using masks and gloves, etc. This disease is so new that even experts struggle to find answers. The only answers we can get is from researches, which take months if not years. And the only way we know we have answers is when a working vaccine is available. Only when a majority of the population are vaccinated can we truly go back to our old lifestyle. We are able to deal with regular flus without changing our lifestyle because of one reason only: we have vaccines for flus. But we don't have it for Covid yet.

Man, you really were in the thick of it in NYC. Good for you to have been working at home. We are retired, so count our blessings every day that we only have to go out when we want or need to. When you have a disease that is killing 30,000 people every month in just the first 6 months, it sure says your attitude of "all bets are off" may be prudent.

GamingPhreak, I'm glad to hear you made it through what must have been a horribly stressful time. That must have been terrifying and demoralizing.

We're starting to go backwards now, and things are closing down again. -- night clubs and banquet halls are closed until further notice Too many people gathering in large numbers, and now of course the children are about to go back to school.

I'm going to grab my flu shot early this year.

The public elementary and high schools here in Chicago are all doing remote learning right now. I have been reading that some colleges with in school classes are having problems.

On the home front, we're having trouble getting our preferred brand of cat food and having to buy brands we've never heard of that are more expensive AND our cats don't like them.

Oldbroad, have you tried Chewy.com? That's the only place I can get the cat food and litter that I need.

The cases are exploding here in my little rural area. A week ago, I was invited to go out to eat with a group of women friends I haven't seen in a long time. I was so tempted, but I declined as I just wasn't comfortable. Plus I know a couple of them are anti-maskers and take no precautions. Well, thank heavens I didn't go. One of them had been going to Bingo games and tested positive for COVID. Now her husband has it and they are both extremely sick. Two close friends from my home town got it by simply going out to eat and coming home. This small - 800 people - town had a family days and no masks or social distancing was done. It's spreading like wildfire through the town and Bonnie had to be ambulanced to a large hospital and she nearly died. She has ZERO underlying conditions and is a big healthy Dutch gal. Six weeks later, she can hardly walk out to her garden yet. They told her she had lung AND heart damage which might be permanent. I am so sick of this thing and feel so bad for my grandkids missing out on so much. But COVID is nothing to take lightly...

We're pretty much in the same boat as you Drac. Our village population just tops out at about 1000 folks, and we now have the highest total number positive in our county. Same reasons you cited, small town summer activities weren't well regulated and few paying attention to social distancing. All the gov offices (city hall, post office) were taking precautions, but the private businesses were running same as usual, no masks. The gas station had a piece of clear painters tarp hanging just below chin level in front of the cashier. Other than that, everything else is pretty much same ol', same ol'.

We have German family visit every year, but of course not this year because anyone from the EU was barred from entry and because they had no desire to come to the US where are virtually no precautions compared to Germany. My SIL asked me Sunday how things were going in Germany. I told her, their economy was opening up and things were starting to slowly get back to normal. They still have outbreaks, but they are quickly contained. But I told her they have a national mask mandate and people there are taking it seriously - Petra told me no one goes anywhere without a mask and social distancing. Their doctors say the same thing as mine - however imperfect, masks and social distancing are the best defense until there is a reliable vaccine. Of course, Germany is a very small place compared to the sprawling US, but perhaps the attitudes of the Germans are what makes the difference.

Draclvr, I have not tried Chewy.com but have looked there. I would have to buy a case of each item though I just don't think it would work for various reasons, though I am keeping it in mind if the situation worsens, to use as a supplement (not as a main source).

I do buy the case of cat food and have it auto shipped every 3 weeks. The litter I have shipped every 4 weeks. I especially like the heavy litter delivered to my doorstep!

I mean I'd have to buy each case that they sell, in one purchase. My cats won't eat the same stuff all day long, every day. They need variety and they still get sick of it because they are fed upstairs by me and downstairs by my brother. We go through litter pretty fast too, though I can't say exactly how fast. My brother does the shopping and I don't pay much attention to the litter, only the food I keep upstairs. There is a cat litter box upstairs and downstairs and both of them get constant use by the 4 cats.

Depending on what brand you use, you can also get variety packs. I tried two of them... but my cat won't eat anything but liver and chicken! And only Fancy Feast liver and chicken at that! Salmon? Nope. Seafood feast? Nope. Whitefish? Nope!!! So, I just went back to the same old thing because that's all she will eat day in and day out!

We used to have a cat or two that would only eat one flavor, one brand, but these cats get tired of the same thing fed to them too often, and that can happen quickly when we're both feeding them. Fancy Feast is what we're having trouble with. If the case packs were in 6's instead of 24's, they'd probably work. Or even 12's and we could split it between downstairs and upstairs.

Fancy Feast Medleys come in packs of 12. Covid was what got me shopping there, but I will continue now. I think our cats are spoiled!

Okay, now that's really serious!

Honestly, if I wasn't able to get my spoiled cat's preferred pouch food, we would not hear the end of it. Not ever.

I've been using the Chewy site for years. I started because my dog has a sensitive stomach and can only eat products made by Hill's Science Diet. Chewy's prices, especially for the snacks are half what is charged in any local pet store. He eats dry dog food which I have shipped regularly. I purchased one case of dog food over a year ago for when he gets a sick stomach, and still have plenty available. I've also gotten some other cool stuff from Chewy such a lighted collar for walking him in the dark, as well as some cute doggie jewelry.

School season is definitely shaky. Friends from the community college I recently retired from have told me that there was an effort to find a way to allow students in but the mechanics of spacing just weren't logical. One of my friends is an advisor who explained that if any student wants to meet with her in person, permission has to be granted by a dean so arrangements can be made. The college has a fairly large BNAT program. I learned that the anatomy classes were reduced from 10 per course to 5 students so safe distancing can be done for the required lab hours. Another of my friends has a daughter in her last semester at an out of state (Indiana) college where they've eliminated all breaks so classes will run 12 straight weeks to avoid back and forth home visits. She's an upper classman (senior yr) who rented an apartment with 3 other students. She told her mom that many of the freshman and sophmores are doing the typical things of going to parties. They're wearing masks, but is that enough? She's assured her mom, she isn't participating in those events. She's a very sweet, smart, reliable young lady. When she was home during the summer, she came once a day to give my energetic dog a good walk. The first time, she took off running and she was right beside her having the time of his life. I'd never seen him run like that before

Dogs have masters, cats have staff.

Truer words were never spoken!

Quite so.

Are any Boomers affected by the awful fires? The smoke from Oregon has blown in over us and visibility is very poor.

Winfrey and Carol just landed in California to go check on their home there. She said it was awful driving and felt like they were breathing smoke even in the car.

I am approximately 15 miles west of part of the fire; the area over the road across from us was given an evacuation warning several days ago. So far things are okay here, but we do have our important stuff packed in bags in case something suddenly changes and we are told that we have to evacuate. It doesn't look like this is going to happen now, but we are still on our guard. My son has been sitting up all night for the last several nights to monitor the situation; he then goes to bed in the early a.m. and I get up and take over the watch until about noon.

The worst part is the smoke - worst air I have ever been in. And they say that they don't expect full containment of this fire until the middle of October. Hopefully the smoke issue will dissipate before the end of the month, because like this it's what you would expect if you had to reside in Hades.

My son had a telephone appointment with his doctor yesterday. She called him from a city to the southwest of us, quite a few miles away from where she lives and where she works. This is because she did have to evacuate and may not be able to return home for several weeks.

It's been an extraordinarily stressful week and this year was already easily the worst year I could remember in a decade. And those other nine years were no picnic.

And as an extra added bonus, I am reading articles telling me that this smoky air we are being exposed to makes us more vulnerable to the coronavirus. Just what I needed to hear.

I have awful asthma, and so the smoke is very bad for me, and yes, my Doctor tells me I have to be extra careful.

Fortunately, we haven't had a bad fire season here this year, but it could still happen if we get a lot of dry weather.

Here in the U.K. We are getting a lot of news coverage of those dreadful fires.
I do so hope all of you at any possible risk will stay safe.

And with significant disasters happening in many other countries too AND the illness and deaths the virus is causing worldwide, it seems everywhere is being ravaged right now.

Makes one very grateful for the smallest of respites

I didn't realize you were so close to the fires this time Marian. That does not sound fun at all, standing watch! Is this the one that started with the "gender reveal" party?

Sending hugs and best wishes that you stay safe and that your home stays safe also.

Well, just went reading and watching some of the fires, over 29 major wildfires. Geesh. I don't know where I've been. I haven't really been seeing this on the news.

No, the fire that started from the "gender reveal" was in Southern California.

Thank you for the good wishes, oldbroad. It is extremely smoky here this morning but the temperature has dropped somewhat and that surely is a good thing.

Hopefully there will be a weather change, at least in the Northwest. It is getting cooler, I hear. Maybe it will rain.

I wish people would stop using incendiaries in dry weather. What part of spark + hot weather + dry wood do people not understand? During fire season here, you can see that many of the fires start along roadways, where people have flicked a cigarette butts.

Please stay safe, everyone. On top of everything else going on right now, the fear of losing a home must be unbearable.

Marian, Hugs and Positive vibes on the way.

Thank you, Connie.

Keeping you in our thoughts as well Marian. We've got a friend just outside of Oregon City, who's been keeping us up to date on the conditions there, so kind of have an idea what you're dealing with. Stay safe.

TM

Thank you, TM. Much appreciated.

Right now here on Vancouver Island our sky is as dark as a foul January day and visibility is so bad they're probably going to have to start the fog horn at the lighthouse soon.

If it's this bad up here, I can't imagine how awful it must be closer to the fires.

You've got me studying my geography today, looking at maps to see where everything and everybody is .

Stay safe everybody!

Hagatha, I was just talking to my ex-husband's widow; sadly, my ex (my only marriage and the father of my son and my daughter) died on July 26th, which was another shock that none of us has recovered from. He was diagnosed with cancer around the beginning of June and by the end of July he was gone. Anyway, their house is in Oak Harbor, Washington and she was telling me how bad the smoke is there, so no real surprise to me that Vancouver Island is so awful.

The air quality here is beyond hazardous, according to their numbers and how they calculate such things. I have never seen anything like this in my life. We have the worst air quality in the world right now, worse than New Delhi and Beijing apparently.

I read about the dangers to the firefighters from the air quality... Winfrey said it was like breathing smoke through a wet mask. At their house up in the mountains, it's not quite as bad, but still awful. Marian, I think their home there is not too far from you... it's in Pine Mountain Lake.

Pine Mountain Lake is about 75 miles from here. I remember years ago Winfrey telling me her brother lived three miles from where I am, although I don't know if that's still the case.

More Marian!

Keep safe, Marian, and anyone else who might be close to a danger zone

My heart goes out to all of you on the west coast!
When I was 14, my family (6 of us) was displaced by an apartment fire. We lost everything and had to start completely over. Ever since then, fire scares me to death. I know first hand what damage it can do.

Marian, I'm sorry to hear about your ex-husband's passing. Cancer is so insidious. Since my husband's diagnosis two of our friends have died from cancer, both of them quite quickly.

I was reading an article in the Washington Post yesterday about the California fires, how the heat plumes are 10,000 feet higher than any previously recorded. It must be terrifying to live in parts of California these days, with the fire seasons getting so bad. Our Okanagan is a similar landscape and there have been terrible fires there in recent years with the summer heat and dry grass.

Thanks, hagatha. I appreciate your kind words.

We are out of danger now with the fire(s), but the smoke is still very bad. I suspect this smoke will be around for a few more weeks, unfortunately.

Marian, I'm glad you're out of danger from the actual fires now. Do you need a mask while in your home?

Here in Chicago, we are supposed to be seeing "hazy skies" and "milky white skies" next week from the smoke out there.

Does anybody else feel like people can't hear them when you talk to them through your masks? I have only been out a few times wearing one but found myself shouting as if the other person cannot hear me.

So glad to hear at least the fire danger is past you. I'm reading about how dangerous the smoke is for people with COPD and other breathing iddues.

Oldbroad, I don't seem to have a problem with anyone understanding me, but I'm having a hard time! Before I got my hearing aid for my right ear which has severe nerve damage from measles when I was little, I relied on lip reading a lot. Didn't realize how much I did until I couldn't see people's faces while they are talking! The only place I venture out to is the grocery store and then only if I need meat, so my interactions are very short.

I have read that New York City was seeing hazy skies as a result of the smoke being blown across the country by the jet stream. I also read that it is starting to make itself felt in Northern Europe.

I don't need a mask in my home but we are keeping the windows closed and running fans. Before we did that, I was waking up every morning with a sore throat.

And I do think the masks can be impediments to communication. It takes more patience.

So far I haven't had a problem understanding anybody else and nobody has implied that they could not hear me. It is just in my mind that I have to speak louder because of the mask. I've only been to two banks. One in the drive through but one I had to go inside and talk to somebody. I shouted!

I finally lost it yesterday in a store where nobody was wearing masks even though there were signs everywhere stating that masks were required. It was a small liquor store and I raised my voice asked everybody if they really didn't care about anyone else, were they all that self-centered.

This being Canada, everyone looked sheepish and a couple of them went back to their cars to get masks. A couple of drunks shuffled around and mumbled a bit. But I was mad and if anyone had beaked off at me I'm not sure what I would have done.

Hagatha, you did what I have wanted to do on several occasions, but didn't have the nerve and instead mumbled under my breath. Good for you!

I'm surprised you didn't get a few "Sorry, eh"

In our neck of the woods folks seem to be taking it more seriously. The last numbers here have not been good. The state had the largest increase in cases since this insanity started. Our health department is reporting that about 20% of past cases so far are coming back in with secondary issues, even though the recovery rate is increasing. I think that's what's giving people food for thought.

Cases are on the rise here in Canada, too, mostly among young people who can't stop socializing (was I that stupid and selfish when I was 20?). Of course, kids are now back in school, too. We're back to only going out for necessities.

The lingering effects of COVID are pretty depressing. The young woman behind the till during the infamous liquor store incident told me she'd had COVID five months ago and still wasn't feeling well -- yet she was only wearing a plastic face shield, which is useless. I wonder where people are getting their information?

They're not useless. In some cases they're better than masks -- especially for people who tend to pick at the masks with their hands.


Maybe from websites like this
https://www.aarp.org/health/healthy-living/info-2020/shields-compared-to-masks.html

I think it depends on the shield. I've seen shields that cover the entire face and extend down below the chin (we have two of those and wear them with masks when we're in the hospital), but the one this young woman had on barely covered her mouth. There's no way it was effective.

i have omar 50 PCS Disposable FACE MASK you wear 10 days, i have too much in my life to count how long did i wear it. i do not sit on the computer all day, i am busy, not perfect.

We're officially in a second wave now in four provinces, including BC.

So many people not wearing masks. I'm starting to call them out in stores all the time now. Signs up everywhere saying masks are mandatory but nobody paying attention.

my mask is cheap, i have to pick at it, it moves as you talk, that why i pick at it , i guess i am a bad person..

I like my masks. They were made by a local company of women who make custom pillows and stuff like that. They are 4 layers thick with a slot for a filter if you want. They are cotton, very comfortable and I wash them once a week.

Good for you hagatha. That's the problem with mask mandates - who is going to enforce them.

Hi, Marian, Yes they still live near you.. they went and stayed at a friends house as they have a swamp cooler and it was pulling the smoke into the house... it was terrible at PML! I only went out when I had to and wore a mask.. Carol drove to Modesto and bought a hugh air purifier. This was not a fun trip but we had to do some things...had to. Glad to be back home. Glad to know you are ok. I thought about you while I was there.

Thanks, Winfrey. This was certainly not a good time for a visit so I assumed that you and Carol really needed to come out here or else you would have traveled here some other time. We have a couple of air purifiers in our house now which certainly do help. Good to know that your relatives still live nearby.

Nobody thinks you're a bad person. My mask makes my nose itch like crazy. There's one spot on the right side of my nose that ALWAYS itches, every single time. Every now and then I just have to scratch, and then I have to sanitize my hands and start all over again. But I think it's important.

thanks hagatha, you made me feel better.masksmy masks were bought at amazon, by my sister, i bought 2 cloth kroger masks, jenny forgot since this the quality gone down..

My preferred masks are washable cotton ones - made by a local person.

I find the standard disposable blue ones really uncomfortable

I do too, Mad. They are constantly getting in my eyes and I do like family and am always adjusting it. I much prefer my washable cotton ones made by a local group of women who formed a company called Mother Earth Pillows.

I think anyone who wears a mask is just plain smart, kind and courteous because it's not always easy or feasible to do safe distancing. Wearing a mask, no matter what kind, as long as it covers nose and mouth, is better than not doing anything at all.

Hagatha, your need to spout off reminded me of a friend of mine who did something similar. She went to college when she was in her 50s, and daytime classes were frustrating because of yacking noise from the younger students, even and especially when the professor was talking. One day, she had enough. She stood up and told all the students to shut up because she had paid for her class and wanted to hear what the prof was saying. She did this in several of her classes. When she graduated, she receive a 'humanitarian' award from those professors because she was able to do what they couldn't. Good for you to speaking your mind!

I love that story, butterflybabe! And I totally agree, wearing a mask even if you don't have to is a reflection that you are concerned about others, not just yourself.

one of the atlanta falcon player has it, he will sit out, i do not know how long of the games.

Finally some beautiful days for us to get out and about before the winter rain sets in.

Case numbers are still going back up. Manitoba has instituted mandatory mask-wearing in indoor public spaces. I'm hoping BC does the same. I know people are really tired of all of this (I am) but we all still need to be really careful and stay safe.

On a happier note, our Southern Resident Orca, which are endangered, have produced two apparently healthy babies this summer. We also have a couple of baby humpbacks this year.

I read that about your Southern Resident Orca population! A brief glimmer of hope in an otherwise dreadful year.

You can't imagine how adorable a baby Orca is until you see one up close -- and being baby mammals, they're curious and naughty and do come right up to you. They have little round faces. Now, an infant Humpback is the size of a small bus, but even so, they're tiny in comparison to an adult., and they're equally cute behaviour-wise.

Things like this make life bearable.

Just reading your description of those babies brought a smile to my face, hagatha.

The Transient Orca family pods with babies will travel for a while, and then they stop for an hour or two to let the baby play while the adults hunt. We've seen this a few times. They splash around and try to breach. We've seen one blow bubbles just under the surface. Usually one of the adults will come over to the boat from time to time to remind us that they're watching.

Humpback mothers are a little more laissez-faire, allowing their babies to swim freely, but if the young one swims right up to the boat, which they do since we're smaller than they are, the mother will come over and shoo the little one away.

I'd love to do this just once!

Sounds Wonderful, wish I could see it.

It keeps us sane during these awful times.

The whale-watching tours have been able to run this summer, as most of the tour boats are Zodiacs open to the air. These days they're headed north to look for grizzlies in the Mainland river mouths. We have a radio so we follow them sometimes, since they all talk to each other and there's always someone who knows where the whales and bears are.

If any of you ever have the chance, it truly is the thrill of a lifetime to see these beings up close.

Add that to my bucket list which is getting longer, and delayed by the current shenanigans.

President Trump revealed early Friday morning that he and the first lady, Melania Trump, had tested positive for the coronavirus,

Just saw his take off on the Marine helicopter for Walter Reed Hospital. I hope they can do more for him than for 95% of those who come down with Covid-19.

Tennessee Titans vs Pittsburgh Steelers postponed, Buffalo Bills game questions remain, and Patriots-Chiefs postponed after positive COVID-19 tests for both teams

Yep. This virus does not discriminate. Anyone can get it, and that's why we all have to take every precaution we can., to protect ourselves and others.

Stay safe, everyone.

he Titans now on the reserve/COVID-19 list include: defensive captain DaQuan Jones, long snapper Beau Brinkley, wide receiver Adam Humphries, outside linebacker Kamalei Correa, and rookie cornerback Kristian Fulton, their second-round pick out of LSU, with receiver Cameron Batson and tight end Tommy Hudson from the practice squad.

Offensive tackle Isaiah Wilson, Tennessee’s first-round pick out of Georgia, has been on the reserve/COVID-19 list since Sept. 6.


The NFL first postponed, then rescheduled the Titans’ game set for Sunday against Pittsburgh to Oct. 25 during Tennessee’s bye. The league also moved Baltimore’s bye to Week 7, so the Ravens now can play Pittsburgh on Nov. 1.

Officials from the NFL and its players’ union met with the Titans on Friday reviewing the situation., Kansas City Chiefs practice squad quarterback Jordan Ta'amu has tested positive for COVID-19 and is being placed on the reserve/COVID list, The news comes shortly after it was learned that Patriots QB Cam Newton also tested positive for the COVID-19 virus .Chiefs and Patriots to be postponed for either Monday or Tuesday.

Maybe playing contact sports in the middle of a pandemic isn't such a good idea after all?

Well, now, that just seems like a great big - DUH - to me

Yes, it kind of does.

Good thing I have a stack of new games to play for the upcoming winter months in semi-isolation.

embrace with Patriots cornerback Stephon Gilmore and The image of Mahomes and Gilmore together was widely shared Wednesday morning after news broke that Gilmore tested positive for COVID-19. The news of Gilmore's positive test and the Titans' facility continuing to remain closed following two additional Titans players testing positive for COVID-19 was a topic around NFL news conferences Wednesday . NFL Network's Tom Pelissero, and Mahomes told reporters he has taken extra precautions since this weekend including sleeping in a separate bedroom from his pregnant fiance. Meanwhile, a player for the Las Vegas Raiders has also tested positive. Goodell signed off on this plan even though we all know that the virus can incubate for days and a negative test one day could easily become a positive test the next. Even as this very nightmare scenario was playing out for all to see at the White House, Goodell wasn’t concerned.For the first time after years of scandal and public relations disasters, Goodell is messing with the league’s money. The NFL doesn’t need fans for mega-profits. Its cash flows come from its multibillion-dollar TV deals. If there are no games, that means no broadcasting, and that means no dough. That scenario for the NFL bosses might very well be a bridge too far. what do you think.

I suppose at some point one has to decide which is more important -- lives, or money. I know in which direction my heart steers me.

I am so sick of hearing about COVID.
If you have any other health problem you can just go to hell.
I needed a tuberculosis test and wasn't able to get one because all they care about is damned COVID.
Because starving to death, and watching your family starve, is so much more pleasant than dying of a respiratory infection.

Guess it depends on whether you or your loved one is the one doing the dying. My aunt isn't expected to live the night. My very good friend survived, but may need a lung transplant in the future. Not only are we all sick of hearing about it, but I think a lot of us are sick of living it too. I needed to get my semi-annual test for a cancer blood antigen and couldn't get it for three months either.

COVID is overhyped.
It depends more on how they've overhyped COVID.
So much FUD and so little actual honest information.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FUD
It would be less annoying and obnoxious if they'd just be honest about it instead of making out like it was going to kill off 100% of the population.
You're better off taking zinc and Vitamin D3, which you should probably be taking anyway to ward off other disease and deficiencies. But no they don't tell you that, they'd rather make out like everyone is doomed so they can control you with their FUD.

Just to be clear, I was responding to family's question, which related to sports and how much the team owners would stand to lose if the season was cancelled. To me there is no choice in this situation. People's lives are more important to me than whether a fabulously wealthy person loses money.

jenny ;25 NFL footballs has it, one player is embracing another one with it, in NFL and covid there is one title, The NFL Season Could Be Facing a Covid Collapse, where i got some of it, the other is https://www.thenation.com/article/society/cam-newton-patriots-covid/ and https://www.nfl.com/news/patrick-mahomes-other-players-react-to-latest-covid-19-developments-in-nfl.

Yah, yah. It's all over the news. The same worthless "information" and FUD.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FUD
Do you think I have to hear it 60 times? It's been many years since I was a 2-year-old and I don't appreciate the news media's attempts to manipulate people.
Most of the people upset about football are the fans, not the team owners, and it's not the "fabulously wealthy" people who are in danger of starving to death because their jobs have been taken away.

I hope your aunt feels better, Drac.

My aunt is dead this morning, Jenny.

sorry about that drac, maybe you are right.

I'm sorry to hear you lost your aunt, Draclvr.
At least she's past all the nonsense now.

How ugly. My Aunt Betty would MUCH PREFER to be here with her family in the middle of all the nonsense - alive.

Thank you, family.

So, so, sorry to read this Drac. My condolences to you and your family!

Thank you, Winfrey. My Aunt Betty was so looking forward to Thanksgiving and Christmas. She had the best holiday dinners with the entire family.

Drac, my thoughts and prayers are with you and the family.

I am in total agreement with you Jenny100, I've reached the saturation point, I've had enough of it. You can't turn the tv on without being bombarded with it. I too need test done but can't get them.

I'm so sorry for your loss Draclvr.

I am so sorry for your loss, Drac. Too many people have been lost to this. Gentle hugs

It's worse for the people left behind than for those who've moved on.

I think we can all agree it's sad.

Drac, I'm so sorry to hear about your aunt.

Thank you connie, judith, hagatha and l4l. I'm sure we're all pretty sick of hearing about and watching people die and living this whole thing.

I've buried two husbands and I know what it's like for those left behind only too well. But I happen to know that my Aunt Betty would thoroughly disagree with you, Jenny. She didn't want to die and was terrified and furious.

Sorry to read your sad news, Draclvr, and send my sincere condolences

Drac, I am so very sorry for your loss. My heart is heavy for you and the whole family.

I just popped in and see many messages, on both sides of the fence in understanding what is happening in this world right now with the Covid and election going on. The continuous changes in our lives and the bombardment of media thrown at us is creating a bigger divide by the day. There are silent members who also are not posting for fear of disagreeing with the need to wear masks etc and in my personal opinion the topic as it stands right now has reached its limit.

I feel we all can agree that this year has been a challenge and we all deal with it differently, but we all wish each other well.
Some of the chit chat in here such as the whales have been really delightful to read and we do have a chat thread that is opened weekly by Joe aka gymcandy for near 15 years now that would welcome such chat. Please feel free to contribute and say hi there.

Please do what you feel is best to be healthy, happy and respectful of others in your orbit. Let's send something positive out in the universe for peace and good health for all.

Ana