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Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123376
06/29/03 04:30 AM
06/29/03 04:30 AM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 541
Yorkshire
Diamond Offline
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Yorkshire
In fact, if someone gives me 4 million, I'll make it. laugh

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123377
06/29/03 04:38 AM
06/29/03 04:38 AM
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,657
Haifa; ISRAEL
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Haifa; ISRAEL
~~ Jenny100 ~~

I read your post above, word for word, and for a second time ... which I don't usually do.

I couldn't agree with you more on every sentiment you express in it.

THANKS ... Len.

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123378
06/29/03 06:16 AM
06/29/03 06:16 AM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 85
Sacramento, Ca. USA
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I agree with Jenny 100. Genres exist because they attract different audiences for different reasons. When they include elements to the extent that they compromise the enjoyment of their target audience, this is not a good thing either for the game industry or the player. Incorporating action/timed sequences in a game marketed as "adventure" then proceeding to turn off adventure players that don't like or cannot cope with these sequences is hardly promoting the genre and in fact guaranteed to lose players. If the vision of the developer feels it is necessary, then they should definitely include a method to bypass the sequence thus not requiring the adventure player to do something he/she cannot or doesn't wish to do. Even one isolated timed event can be huge if it prevents one from finishing the game. Also, including these cheat codes might serve to introduce many adventure gamers to a limited amount of action that they soon discover they enjoy as long as they don't have the fear of being unable to finish the game. I guess the bottom line is: be true to your audience, and if you want to include something else, help them.

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123379
06/29/03 09:03 AM
06/29/03 09:03 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 15,679
England
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England
Well, read my response and you will sum up what we feel as adventurers... No-one can make us all happy, But they can satisfy 95%.

Good going by my estimations!!

Hugs


Tig wave


A bounce a day keeps the doctor away!!
Playing Sims2, Sherlock, Phantom of Venice
Reading Storm Breaking
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123380
06/29/03 02:11 PM
06/29/03 02:11 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 1,800
Ardsley, New York
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Hi all. I'm new here and loving the Boomer experience! I feel totally welcome since I joined here.
I for one don't care about "action" sequences in adventure games if there not slam bang high reflex type of the straight action games (I remember trying to paly Lands of Lore 1 and all of a sudden having 6 monsters come at me at once and getting killed continuously. Ofcourse if there's a GODMODE that's a different case. Nocturne was a great adventure once the Godmode was turned on and you didn't have to worry about tons of creatures trying to kill you, just played it l9ike a regular adventure. GK 2, the Tex Murphy games and Black Dahlia (some of my favorites) all had some action sequences, but they were doable and just took a little thinking and trying to figure out what moves to make (ex. when jim was getting shot at in the cellar in Dahlia or Tex avoiding the hitman in the cabin). Am really looking forward to GK3 even if it is 3D with some action as long as it follows the same type as the Tex's and GK's. I don't mind keyboard and kind of like the 3D look (though my general preference is FMV, wish they'd come out with some more, but I guess those are dead due the expense of creating them).


If the world didn't suck would we all fall off
Now playing Post Mortem, Midnight Nowhere and Still Life
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123381
06/29/03 03:36 PM
06/29/03 03:36 PM
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 31,224
Northwestern New Mexico, USA
Jenny Offline
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I was going to answer this one, but Jenny100 said it all for me! laugh

Good going, Jenny.... wave


"Once you give up integrity, the rest is easy." Anonymous
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123382
06/29/03 04:02 PM
06/29/03 04:02 PM
Joined: Jun 2001
Posts: 3,805
Kentucky, USA
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Where would you put Timeline in this? I considered it more of an arcade game that just had a couple of puzzles. Didn't consider it an adventure game at all. About the only active action in a game that I didn't like was the one in ND: The Scarlet Hand. There just wasn't enough time to figure out how to get out of the tomb/monolith? Even with using a walkthrough, had to do it about three or four times before got out of there. Rise of the Dragon had a combat scene or two and that was okay. Think it even had a by-pass if you got killed too many times. Action in an adventure game for me is playing the wolf in the GK games or the snake circle.


Never resist a generous impulse.
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123383
06/29/03 04:33 PM
06/29/03 04:33 PM
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 403
Austin,Tx
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Austin,Tx
What an interesting thread this is. It has an overwhelming serious theme of people's opinions on the innards of adventure games, with a couple of entertaining sprinkles of outrageous, and outrageously funny, diatribe, of which I've always been a fan.

I find the seriousness to be well thought about and well stated by all and will limit my comments to the two sprinkles. At the risk of offending some or many, hell maybe even all, here goes.

First I found the quoted part of Gaston's email in Ray's article to be very entertaining and funny. This is not to say I agree with what Gaston says, I don't, just that he says it in a stylish manner.

Secondly I find similarity, both in style and humor quotient, between Gaston's email and the following quote from MrNO's post:
..
Its such a juvenile, ignorant, zeno/homophobic, redundant piece of smoke ( only less consistent ) and such an obviously

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123384
06/29/03 07:18 PM
06/29/03 07:18 PM
Joined: May 1999
Posts: 22,381
Seattle Washington USA
Witchen Offline
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Seattle Washington USA
In a word, Ray, bravo!

bravo bravo

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123385
06/29/03 09:38 PM
06/29/03 09:38 PM
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 313
Kehrin Offline
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Thanks for saying it so articulately, Jenny100. You expressed many of my thoughts and feelings.

If there was a way past those puzzles that I can't do, I'd be able to finish a lot more games. I've lost track of how many times I've wished for a "solve this puzzle for me" button!

laugh

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123386
06/29/03 10:48 PM
06/29/03 10:48 PM
Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 31,224
Northwestern New Mexico, USA
Jenny Offline
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Northwestern New Mexico, USA
Didn't you know that there is one of those buttons on your computer, Kehrin? It's in a secret place (like the Rime Age in Myst), so you won't be tempted to use it all the time.

But of course I couldn't possibly tell you where it is--it wouldn't be fair to expose you to so much temptation... lol lol


"Once you give up integrity, the rest is easy." Anonymous
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123387
06/30/03 12:33 AM
06/30/03 12:33 AM
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 735
Sydney, Australia
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Sydney, Australia
Well, Pandora'x Box did have one such the button... wink But then it really didn't classify as an adventure game... or did it? wink

Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123388
06/30/03 01:45 AM
06/30/03 01:45 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,522
Indiana
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Shivers 2 had an "I finally give up" button, as well; at least I remember it was there during certain puzzles that were not within the rock maze/chamber. I think it is a good idea, and I don't understand why it isn't possible to include that option in adventure games with action elements. It would actually encourage replaying the game at a later time, because if you skipped a puzzle you might want to go back later and try to solve it! I think it would encourage people who dislike action or skill puzzles to go ahead and buy a game they might otherwise avoid. As many others have said on similar threads, some people can't play games with action or skill puzzles because they can't use their hands in the way required for particular types of action elements. Others just prefer to avoid that sort of element, or fear they will be stuck in the middle of a game and will have to find a saved game or abandon the game without finishing it. Is the cost involved in including a "solve puzzle" button so prohibitive, or are the game developers just not interested in the relatively small number of gamers who would require that sort of option?
Happy gaming,
Beth


What lies behind you and what lies before you are tiny matters compared to what lies within you.
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123389
07/01/03 03:49 PM
07/01/03 03:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 752
Los Angeles, CA. USA
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Los Angeles, CA. USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Scout:
I guess I've been lucky so far. I haven't hit any reflex stuff I couldn't handle.
*cough* Mortalus *cough*


What happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas...
Re: Ray Ivey's Shut-up article... #123390
07/01/03 04:36 PM
07/01/03 04:36 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,006
New Hampshire
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New Hampshire
I find it interesting that Salammbo, a fairly recent game, has had at least two timed "skill" puzzles with a cheat button, that you can hit if you just can't get it. There may even be more - I'm not finished with the game yet. Though I was able to solve both without the cheat, they took several attempts, and were not impossible, but I was glad to know that cheat option was there if I needed it.

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