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Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece #927596
12/02/13 12:45 PM
12/02/13 12:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 848
florida
bigmamma1 Offline OP
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Many reviews have been written about this 2011 sequel to American Macgees Alice. Some have loved it and others have hated it because of its sometimes abruptly changing camera angles, difficult battles and platform jumping.I am finding it very difficult to progress for the same reasons, but the most frustrating thing that almost ruins the pleasure of playing is the auto save feature. If you cant get to the next auto save point before you have to quit for dinner or get sick of trying the same old jump, you have to repeat an already played sequence until you get past the difficult point. Not fun. smashpc Also the seek and find elements are getting a little repetitive.Teeth for weapon upgrades, roses for health, bottles for ? over and over.

That being said, I'm still plugging along because this game is a masterpiece of artwork-like finding your way through a surrealist painting. The worlds are breathtakingly bizzare,humorously scary, and full of weird characters. Alice"s dialogue is amusing and her "advisor" the Cheshire cat who pops up to give her sage advice adds a nice touch of dark humor.

Yes, there is fighting, at times very difficult because of crazy camera angles, but the enemies you come up against are not human, animal, or any other recognizable life form;They are creatures made of teapots, doll parts, slime, kettles, knives and forks, or machine parts. your weapons are unusual too; your trusty vorpal blade for close combat, a hobby horse bludgeon for smashing, and a machine gun-like pepper grinder for long range targets. There's also a teapot cannon which I haven't got to yet.(If I ever finish this game I'll let you know how it works.)Weapons can be upgraded by collecting teeth from varied containers or defeating enemies.

Alice can also shrink to reveal hidden areas to explore and find things, or invisible platforms to jump to other platforms-many other platforms. rolleyes
This makes for a looooong game- Each chapter seems as long as a whole game.I had to resort to God mode to at least get past the enemies quicker but even with this, some of them are very hard to beat.

Even with all the hair pulling frustrations I'm finding it hard to give up on this because of the amazing detail and craftsmanship that went into the design and art that went into this game. Except for the gameplay elements, this is indeed a masterpiece from American Macgee, which was 10 years in the making. Too bad the craftsmanship of the artwork did not go into the gameplay design.

I bought the downloadable version on sale which includes the original Alice. I have to say I liked the original better because of the regular save system and easier controls.Perhaps because it was designed for the PC.
I'm playing this on WIN 7 8GB laptop with no problems.I'll let you know if I ever finish! Meanwhile, would like to hear about other GBer experiences with this one.

Last edited by bigmamma1; 12/02/13 12:55 PM.

People do not remember how much you know,only how you make them feel
finished Gray Matter, playing Alice Madness returns and Deponia
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #927600
12/02/13 01:00 PM
12/02/13 01:00 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
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UK
Rushes Offline
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Thanks for your thoughts on this game, bigmamma!

I also dislike auto save points.

I played partway through the original Alice game, but gave up on it. I found the platforming terribly awkward and the controls fairly 'orrible. I tend not to do well with keyboard-based games in general, though. (I haven't played Madness Returns to compare.)

I hope you get through to finish this one!


"Bleat, Watson -- unmitigated bleat!" ~ Sherlock Holmes
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #928033
12/04/13 09:35 PM
12/04/13 09:35 PM
Joined: Jun 2005
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Draclvr Offline
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I played Madness Returns twice! I loved the concept, the dark story, the graphics... However, like you, I grew extremely frustrated with the auto save feature. I had to replay battles over and over and after while it simply got tedious. I also resorted to Godmode more than once. There is one sequence where the game switches to 2D and you have to jump a series of huge steps and avoid gigantic blocks slamming down. The 2D made the character very hard to control in a sequence that requires precise control. It took me days to get past it and then I was presented with a very difficult jump. I was not allowed to save at that point so I didn't have to repeat the 2D sequence again. That was nearly a deal breaker for me, but I persevered and finally make it through.

The positive elements of the game outweighed the frustrating game save system for me. I had the original disks and played on both my Windows 7 and my Windows 8 computers.

I totally agree with the title of your post!


114 tomato plants pulled up and gardens put to sleep for the winter.
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #928773
12/08/13 05:22 PM
12/08/13 05:22 PM
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florida
bigmamma1 Offline OP
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Drac...I remember that scene with the huge blocks smashing down-
I did manage to get thru that after many many tries-I hope that there isn't
any other feat more difficult than that.
I've taken a rest from Madness for a few days. Now I'm
stuck in Ch. 2 at the place where there is a timed jump to invisible
platforms in order to shoot a red clock. I have to replay a sequence over
and over but never get there in
time to shoot it. AAARRRRGH!
Hats off to you for finishing! I agree that the positive outweighs the negative,
but sometimes I wonder.


People do not remember how much you know,only how you make them feel
finished Gray Matter, playing Alice Madness returns and Deponia
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #928874
12/09/13 10:19 AM
12/09/13 10:19 AM
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 31,651
United Kingdom
Mad Offline
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"I played partway through the original Alice game, but gave up on it. I found the platforming terribly awkward and the controls fairly 'orrible. "

That goes for me, too !! lol


Time : The Most Precious Commodity
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #928886
12/09/13 11:19 AM
12/09/13 11:19 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 40,644
southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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I used god mode with the original Alice and had a lot of fun playing it.
I remember the geysers were hard to get past though.
Fortunately the game had a decent save capability.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #929102
12/10/13 06:25 PM
12/10/13 06:25 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 848
florida
bigmamma1 Offline OP
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waveI loved the first Alice-played once on "easy" mode and again in "god" mode.
Was so looking forward to the next one, but Madness Returns is much harder and much
more frustrating, even though the graphics are so advanced and amazing. Why oh why
do they ruin a beautiful game with autosave?
mad
same with Indiana Jones and the Emporers Tomb- remember that one?


People do not remember how much you know,only how you make them feel
finished Gray Matter, playing Alice Madness returns and Deponia
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #929242
12/11/13 11:21 AM
12/11/13 11:21 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
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southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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I didn't buy Madness Returns because of StarForce on the disc version.
However the lack of a save feature and lack of decent cheats (god mode for the dexterity-impaired like moi) would also be a reason not to buy it.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #929957
12/15/13 07:58 PM
12/15/13 07:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 59
Singleton, Australia
C
Callista Offline
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I bought Alice Returns about 9 months ago and started playing it. I got halfway through the second chapter and was forced to abandon the game as it was far too hard for me, even on the Easy Mode. Thanks to reading this thread and learning of God Mode, I tweaked my game files and now I can smash any creature that gets in my way as well as being able to upgrade my weapons ever so much faster. The graphics are exceptional and I really love playing the game. I hope to finish the game in its entirety before long.

Thanks again GameBoomers for the help on this game that I found by accident.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #929984
12/15/13 10:36 PM
12/15/13 10:36 PM
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Alabama
looney4labs Offline
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Woo Hoo Callista, glad you are playing again and enjoying it wave


"Dogs are not our whole life, but they make our lives whole."
-Roger Caras
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #929996
12/15/13 11:51 PM
12/15/13 11:51 PM
Joined: Apr 2012
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Singleton, Australia
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Is Alice Madness Returns considered to be an Adventure Game or a Role Playing Game (RPG)? The game plays and looks more like an adventure game as you can't really form your own character as in The Elder Scrolls and other similar games. If it is indeed classed as an Adventure Game, then why is there no review on the first Alice game or Alice Madness Returns. MaG would need some time to prepare a walk-through as well for the game as it is soooooo long.

Looking forward to hearing your viewpoint on my query.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930068
12/16/13 10:09 AM
12/16/13 10:09 AM
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UK
Rushes Offline
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It's considered an action adventure, so it would fall under the "Darkside" forum category. GB/MaG tends not to write walkthroughs for anything with an action element. Our reviewers do occasionally dip into that genre, but not often, due either to preference or there being too many "pure" adventure games to be reviewing in the meantime. grin


"Bleat, Watson -- unmitigated bleat!" ~ Sherlock Holmes
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930079
12/16/13 10:34 AM
12/16/13 10:34 AM
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Thank you very much Rushes for explaining all that to me. It was just that I saw the game mentioned in the Forum and I wrongly assumed that it was a normal adventure game. You have been a great help. Thanks again.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930297
12/17/13 11:23 AM
12/17/13 11:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2005
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Draclvr Offline
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I wouldn't have been able to get through Madness Returns without Godmode. That's another thing I wish they would have made a little easier to do... you have to tweak a game file. I hated the auto save, but did get past it. Why, oh, why would you develop such a difficult game and use auto save? I won't go so far as to say it ruined it for me, but like bigmamma, I wondered at times.

You do know for the invisible platforms, you can shrink so you can see them at least momentarily?


114 tomato plants pulled up and gardens put to sleep for the winter.
Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930415
12/17/13 09:39 PM
12/17/13 09:39 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
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Chicago
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How does God mode work (in the original Alice)? I am still trying to get myself to go back to the game and try it again.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: oldbroad] #930564
12/18/13 05:18 PM
12/18/13 05:18 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
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southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
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Originally Posted By: oldbroad
How does God mode work (in the original Alice)? I am still trying to get myself to go back to the game and try it again.

I don't know how it works in Madness Returns.
In the original Alice, I think these were the cheats I used
Quote:
Enable the console in Options, then press ~ and type any of the following "Codes":
Code.........................Effect
god......................God Mode On/Off
wuss....................All Weapons
noclip...................No Clipping On/Off
health #................Set Health to # (100 is full)
notarget................Invisibility
give all..................All Weapons and Ammo
map (mapname)...........Jump to (mapname)(below)
cg_cameradist -45........First Person View
cg_cameradist 128.......Normal View
fps 0/1 Display Frame Rate Toggle (0 = off, 1 = on)
give (item name)........*Get (item name)(below)


You had to refresh the god mode at the beginning of every level.
So you'd hit the ~ key, then type
god
to start god mode.
I remember there wasn't time to use god mode in the level where you're chased by a giant boulder. God mode won't protect you from falling down a bottomless pit either.

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930591
12/18/13 09:16 PM
12/18/13 09:16 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
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Chicago
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Thank you Jenny100. I'll have to try to get into the game and see if this makes sense to me!

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930671
12/19/13 11:57 AM
12/19/13 11:57 AM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 40,644
southeast USA
Jenny100 Offline
GB Reviewer Glitches Moderator
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If you need to know more about enabling the Console window,
http://alice.wikia.com/wiki/Cheats
Quote:
To use the cheats, enable the "Console" window by going into "Settings" and looking for "Game Options."

Re: Alice Madness Returns-a flawed masterpiece [Re: bigmamma1] #930729
12/19/13 09:01 PM
12/19/13 09:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 12,282
Chicago
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Great. Thanks!

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